Both variants are pretty wtf to me. Not necessarily showing the pictures but explicitly pointing out their genitals.
Showing pictures too.
I would argue the top picture is also a big no no.
I thought that is the point
I don't think it really takes a side ... just kind of points out that it's super weird that it's more socially acceptable in one direction than the other.
I do hope the author intended for what I said to be the point though.
You'd think so, but a disturbing number of people think the problem is there is a difference, not the nude photos.
Yeah that's kinda the point.
Definitely, there's nothing "cute" about nude photos of children.
I get a chuckle about Ultra sound images as well. It's fine if a woman wants to post those photos of her insides on the Internet. But I'm the bad guy if I say "Jessica pop that pussy open let's see it in person."
You can't see the baby without the ultrasound. It's not like you could grab a speculum and get a good look in person.
I think it might be the clinical word vagina vs wee wee, but vajayjay still would be weird in this context. Honestly, dont show strangers your kids genitals.
Yes, all genitals seem weird to show people. I don't even show them to my parents. I tried not to take them at all, and instead tried to take a few with angles that obscured any private areas. I think my parents have seen a couple of those, but I don't even send them.
Perhaps the comic is from the mindset 40 years ago. I could easily see parents of that era doing this and thinking it was fine.
It probably differs more across cultures. There are even cultures where public virginity tests are acceptable.
At first I thought you were talking about your own genitals. It really confused me when you wrote about not taking them. Or only at angles.
I was like, was there a choice? Could I have chosen to have no genitals? Or ones with different angles?
Eh. I have plenty of pictures of my daughter naked as a baby. The weird part of this is showing off the naked picture to a stranger on the bus and making mention of the genitals in specific.
Anyway, everyone knows that naked baby pictures are used to torture children in front of their serious romantic partners brought home for the first time. This has not happened in my 14-year-old daughter's life yet, but I hope to one day have this privilege that comes with parenting.
My response, when my mom showed my first partner naked baby pictures was to nudge my partner and say "don't worry, I'll send you some more recent ones.
My mom super didn't appreciate the joke, but she never pulled out baby pictures for future partners.
This is hilarious. Good comeback.
LOL, mom busted out the baby pics for every gf. My. Turn.
Gonna show your new step dad all the naked pics of your mom you have?
That's weird
Oh ew that’s some borderline pedo shit. “Here’s the person you’re fucking as a baby. Hahaha you’re sexually attracted to a baby. I created child pornography just to make you uncomfortable because you’re a normal, non-pedophilic person”
Sorry, you think taking a photo of a baby when they're born is done with the express purpose of doing something decades later?
Downvoted because taking pictures of your child is still weird even though you don't show them to anyone
Sorry... taking pictures of a child is weird?
Do you think cameras steal the soul or something?
His issue was phrasing. The woman used a euphemism which significantly shifted her perceived intentions. “Look at his little wee-wee” is far removed from “look at his little penis.” Synonyms are not created equal, so simply substituting without considering connotation will only cause confusion. He should have said “get an eyeful of her little vagina.”
My mom was one of those top ladies. 😬
It's OK kolanaki, I find your wee wee very cute too
Instance checks out
Showing one or looking one? Nevermind, I don't want to know.
I mean, penises are just inherently funny. Look at them, they’re ridiculous.
I feel personally attacked.
True. Imagine comparing the humour between a meatsicle vs just a hole.
I feel.like we generally give women a pass on A LOT of weird behaviors about children.
That does include elevated attention to the genital area (seriously, why? Leave our genitals alone ffs), borderline fetishizing breastfeeding, and also a lot of other stuff.
Like, for example, I had several women independently telling me how baby feces smell nice and milky. Like, what the hell and why do y'all feel it's appropriate for a casual conversation???
Or that they love to smell baby feet. Huh? Funny thing I first got those stories after seeing a TV ad (was a while ago) with a woman burying her face in baby feet.
I can only assume this is either a result of hormonal shifts throughout pregnancy, or that there's plenty more female pedophiles than we knew.
People are too weird about genitals. Our culture finds it so uncomfortable to talk to their sons about cleaning their penis that we started cutting the foreskin off to spare them the embarrassment.
Depends where in the world you are. In the US it was popularized by Dr Kellogg to curb masturbation. He also recommended a few drops of carbolic acid applied to young girls clits to damage the nerves and avoid what he called "abnormal excitement".
Dude was opposed to pretty much anything even vaguely resembling pleasure, he invented corn flakes as a food to be as bland and tasteless as possible. The only reason they ever became a popular breakfast cereal is because of his brother adding sugar to them despite Kelloggs objections
'cleanliness' and 'looking like their father' were later justifications after the practice had already gained traction.
This is so screwed, too.
Like, I was once tasked to explain to my nephew how to properly clean a penis at, like, age of 7. C'mon, parents, what are you there for?!
Just literally teach it alongside cleaning every other body part, what's the issue? Why should another man show this in particular to your kid?
This doesn't make it justifiable, but circumcision goes back a lot longer than our culture has existed. If Judaism had won out instead of Christianity, it could have been even more widespread than it is now. Some Muslim sects also mandate circumcision, and they could be the ones ruling the world.
Unfortunately, circumcision is a particular form of mutilation that transcends cultures.
women are pure. they can talk about a baby's genitalia and it's cute. if a man wants to be a kindergarten teacher, though, whoa, pedophile alert!
all of em eh? The moment you identify male it's gone I guess, and vice-versa
About smell :
"In 2021, inhalation of hexadecanal was found to reduce aggression in men but to trigger aggression in women.[4] Hexadecanal is one of the most abundant substances emitted by human babies from their heads, which may be an evolutionary survival mechanism to induce mothers to defend the baby and fathers to not attack it. But it is not yet known whether the amount of hexadecanal emitted by humans is sufficient to affect other humans."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HexadecanalIt would make sense. There are other behaviours that directly lower male aggression. Smiling and emotional tears.
Which is awesome for babies since non-human primate males are known to kill offspring of other males in order to get the mother in estrus sooner.
It's also the reason women smile when nervous and cry a lot more. I suppose you have to if you lack offense and defence. E.g. estrogens slowing muscular and skeletal growth in the upper body. And growing hair enough for thermal regulation, but not enough to redistribute blunt forces. The reason beards exist is to protect the jaw.
Interestingly, the main motive for men to commit homicide is dominance seeking behaviour. Men are more likely to kill every age with exception of infants. Women's main motives for homicide are self-defence first and jelousy second. Infanticide is almost exclusively done by women. Often their own too. Never trust a woman who had a miscarriage with your newborn or your pregnant wife. High prolactin, loss of child and stealing babies is not just a human thing.
I wonder how the willingness to kill your own (high risk and expensive) baby influenced human evolution. Since it's the other way around in other primates. Recon it reduced rape to be merely a dominance thing rather than a reproductive strategy?
I am male and I did like sniffing my baby's head. Interesting.
I think it's likely really surprising to learn/experience that feces of a breastfed baby (and to a lesser extent formula fed babies) don't smell like shit. It's natural to want to share a surprising learning. Might also be good to be forewarned the milky smell ends once normal food is introduced.
Nah, it was rather in a context of how cute and nice-smelling babies are, not that it was an immediate new discovery
I had several women independently telling me how baby feces smell nice and milky.
Likely some instincts playing a prank. A lot of mammals lick their baby's shit.
TIL but I don't know if I'm happy about it
Thanks for the share though!
there’s plenty more female pedophiles than we knew
I'm going to go with "Yes"
I'm gonna go ahead and say that it's weird all the way around. Any gender combo for kid/parent/audience.
You saying you think it's weird if I pulled you aside and showed you my little boy's meat sausage I don't understand
You guys want to consider gender in vacuum but it is never a good idea.
Look at the sexualisation and brainwashing of the girls and patriarchy and men having this big power gap and sometimes using it in the most monstrous of the ways even today let alone 100 years ago. This is why the second image is big wtf while the first is small wtf.
That’s because in the first no one would immediately think that they sexualise the boy while in the second we arrive at this conclusion immediately and without hesitation thanks to all the hard work of men thorought history.
I know having this original sin of your fathers on your shoulders is not a cool feeling but this is the reality we are in.
The sooner this collective PTSD heals and that can only happen after some time of treating women as humans, the better for everyone. Problem is that point in history is far, far away considering the core issue is still prevalent.
It will take another 100 years of intense education and raising new generations to have the society that isn’t obviously fucked up and deeply hurt.
No one in the picture or the audience is sexualizing little girls (or boys). Instead, the outrage is caused by harmful expectations of purity that are imposed on girls and women, but not boys. As well as the current moral panic about pedophilia, which again is unhelpful in actuality protecting children.
Want to protect help children from predators? Help them remove the stigma around their bodies and sex, and empower them to speak and be heard when something they don’t like happens. Failing to do so reinforces the feelings of shame that all too often enable predators to get away with what they do.
And maybe also don’t share potentially embarrassing photos without consent but that’s small potatoes compared to the above issues.
Help them remove the stigma around their bodies and sex, and empower them to speak and be heard when something they don’t like happens.
This. So much this. If auntie wants to give them a kiss and they don't want to get slobbered then tough fucking luck auntie, I'll back the little shits up when they bite you. Predators are, by and large, able to do what they do because people don't teach kids that they do, in fact, have bodily autonomy.
And while I'm at it bodily autonomy of kids also implies that parents don't parade photos around like some fucking trophy or something. Have some basic fucking regard for your own kids and what they want. How would you feel when they're showing nude pictures of you to their classmates yeah I thought so.
I like this additional take with pure facts and discussion, It’s mostly uncharacteristically civil and starts to be interesting or at least has potential to be.
However I am mostly focused on why one picture is big wtf and why one is smaller wtf.
Collective ptsd is not real and anyone who uses that term should be mocked mercilessly for the rest of their life.
collective trauma refers to the impact of a traumatic experience that affects and involves entire groups of people, communities, or societies. Collective trauma is extraordinary in that not only can it bring distress and negative consequences to individuals but in that it can also change the entire fabric of a community (Erikson, 1976).
I appreciate your efforts but it is a real, scientifically proven phenomenon.
Aydin, C. (2017). How to Forget the Unforgettable? On Collective Trauma, Cultural Identity, and Mnemotechnologies, Identity, 17:3, 125-137, DOI: 10.1080/15283488.2017.1340160
You're right, but I feel showing people photos of your child's genitals should never be OK, outside of medical professionals etc.
The hot tl;dr of this that is going to get you a lot of angry boys sending you incoherent diatribes is that we haven't decided as a species that we will stop sexualizing youth.
Yes there are biological imperatives for the sexually aggressive sex to seek out mates that are young, healthy and capable of producing offspring before they become too old to reproduce. That's all a thing that's real, but it's as far distant in our past as most other ancient instincts that we've put to rest. We just keep this one alive because we want it to continue broadly. The whole notion of older men predating and sexualizing youthful appearances or "innocence" as standards of femininity is absolutely something that if we all decided together was no longer acceptable, it would end tomorrow. (Or realistically in one generation.) This is not a more natural part of us than anything else we choose to follow or not, because we are well above using any natural response system as an excuse to allow dangerous social norms to continue.
The reason I say this is because there are a lot of men who will secretly or overtly hold the position that since we have biological urges, then it must be natural and acceptable. Meanwhile, ya'll fuckers completely ignore the thousand other biological drives and standards that we've abolished because they're unproductive, hurt people or just have gone out of style.
For example: body odor. Do you really think we were using soap and perfume when we were packed together in huts and caves for the last thousand millennia? You are genetically identical to the people who used to bury their faces in each other's armpits to identify each other in the dark, but the thought makes you gag now because you were socialized to feel repulsion at this. (Fetishes aside.) We can socialize ourselves to believe and internalize almost anything, we are far, far beyond the forces of natural selection and are now choosing our evolutionary path. Wouldn't it be nice if we chose good paths that respected others and protected children.
(Fetishes aside.)
damn, you got me on that one.
It will take another 100 years of intense education and raising new generations to have the society that isn’t obviously fucked up and deeply hurt.
I don't share in your positivity.
sexualisation and brainwashing of the girls and patriarchy and men having this big power gap
Women can do what men can't = sexualisation and brainwashing of the girls and patriarchy. Ok. "Men having this big power gap" indeed.
and sometimes using it in the most monstrous of the ways
tl;dr "Misandry is perfectly fine because men are evil and nothing a woman has ever done is wrong."
The problem isn't that the bottom scenario isn't accepted, it's that the top scenario is. No one should be showing off nudes of children in public, or anywhere really, regardless of gender. It's weird, it's sick, and it has no place in this world.
You misinterpreted OP, otherwise I also do think the top scenario is weird.
we arrive at this conclusion immediately and without hesitation thanks to all the hard work of men thorought history.
you say this like women have ever had rights to the point that being ogled at "would be bad" the one argument here would be the "daughter is her fathers property" and that's not really a gender thing, that's a social custom about gender more than anything.
Thanks for the lecture, professor.
My god damn pleasure sub
Maybe we should encourage suicides in boys starting in schools, would that work for you? Edit: if you are going to down vote me the offer an idea the left will actually do. Otherwise I guess we are bringing up more republican rapists. '50% of the world population would feel safer if you died' is the messaging the left offers so lean I to it or change the messaging
username checks out.
Having had four kids, if you are showing people pictures of any baby in the bath naked, they're gonna be upset no matter the gender. I don't think his is true at all.
I wish I could burn half my mother's photo albums.
You can. Just not yet
Given there are people in this thread defending this tooth and nail, that's quite reassuring to know actually.
Let me guess. You're a guy.
Situation also matters. This appears to be on a bus and between acquaintances. Do this same thing at home toward the adult child's significant other and it becomes a funny thing parents do to embarrass their kids.
funny thing parents do to embarrass their kids
And what is funny about that?
That's parents' favorite move! "Ha! You used to be smaller! And naked!" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Le small pp
Funny for the parents
I just wouldn't bring my significant other around if my parents were like that. That's absolutely gross behaviour.
Yes.
And why do we think that might be different? Anyone?
Because they are sitting in a pink colored train, and not in the blue colored one.
Also no, but interesting point
So labia, then? Or vulva, maybe. Unless that camera is an internal one, they're likely not seeing any vaginas.
I too took middle school health class
Of course, you're technically very right - what they see is not vagina.
But in the culture, the word often simply refers to female genitals as a whole.
That doesn't mean anyone using that word is not aware of the words "labia" and "vulva", they can even differentiate between labia majora and labia minora etc.
But for the sake of brevity and simplicity, people just say "vagina", even if it's not necessarily a technically correct term.
I feel you and what everyone is doing annoys me too, but our only recourse is to do something worse.
My proposal: we start calling our cock “corpora cavernosa”.
Examples:
- “Hey, Chumley, don’t just stand there with your corpora cavernosa in your hand.”
- ”He’s being a total corpora cavernosa!”
- ”My corpora cavernosa got pinched by my zipper.”
- ”Hey, bro, does my corpora cavernosa hook off to the right?”
I wish I was still dumb enough to be conservative. I was happier than. I hate myself now everyday I wish I had the courage to kill myself
Wtf?
"I wish I didn't know about societal and existential problems of humanity. I was happier when I didn't. I hate myself now everyday, I wish I had the courage to stop my suffering."
I was. I was still angry all the time, but at least it was not at myself
Conservatives live in an endless cycle of outrage and fear, the fuck you talking about happy
Maybe comfortable is the better word.
That is, anger, outrage, paranoia, and ignorance are their comfort zone. It’s what they know. And in my little corner of the world, the more vociferously conservative they are, the less self-aware they are about it.
It’s really pervasive in ways I never truly realized until way too far into adulthood when I was working to get that shit out of my own head.
Sounds like a really strong need for therapy.
In the meantime would you be willing to elaborate on whats making you depressed?
DEAR GOD! The patriarchy! Women have it so much harder than men!
Nowadays, girls can have a wee wee. 😬
No, they are babies, they don't even know how to speak, how are they going to be able to know what "gender" even means?
Calling a baby with wee wee a girl is the same as calling your 18 year old trans daughter a boy, you are just trying to brainwash them.
Oh, hee hee hee.
"Nowadays, boys can have a vagina."
What the fuck!?
the child cant talk yet and has no sense of wtf a "gender" is, its fine lol
They waited 6 months to drop this knowledge bomb.
... and?
