Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school
Uproar as after-school Satan club forms at Tennessee elementary school
Satanic clubs, whose members do not worship the devil, usually formed in response to presence of religious groups in schools
Community members in a Tennessee school district want to banish Satan from their children’s halls after the formation of a new club was announced.
The After School Satan Club (ASSC) wants to establish a branch in Chimneyrock elementary school in the Memphis-Shelby county schools (MSCS) district.
The ASSC is a federally recognized nonprofit organization and national after-school program with local chapters across the US. The club is associated with the Satanic Temple, though it claims it is secular and “promotes self-directed education by supporting the intellectual and creative interests of students”.
The Satanic Temple makes it clear its members do not actually worship the devil or believe in the existence of Satan or the supernatural. Instead Satan is used as a symbol of free will, humanism and anti-authoritarianism.
The outrage these assholes are feeling is what the rest of us feel every time we see them trying to force their dogma into every facet of society.
Me and my wife are both members of TST and we LOVE the work they do. The Tenets they promote are loving, self-respecting, and do justice towards an ideal world of Individualism, anti-authoritarianism, and critical thinking - i.e. everything that Christianity and modern conservatism in general are eager to suppress. We regularly donate to them, and we constantly purchase stuff through their store to help support them.
Another member here, are donations tax deductible?
Open question to anyone: how much shit do you get being TST members? Do you just keep it on the downlow? I can very much imagine consequences if it got around at work, etc. Any repercussions may be illegal, but a lot of people are "ask questions later, sort it out in court if it gets there" types.
My work associates are all extremely liberal so they were actually pretty stoked. A couple others had no idea what it was, but LOVED the concept after it was explained to them.
A good friend of mine who's a Christian Pastor was the only one that was like...shocked. lol. After he chilled out and I got to explain it to him, he was all in favor of it. He's not a big fan of the mainstream evangalism shit that's going on, so TST being a way to fight the encroachment of the alt-right/Supply-side Jesus on our government was a big win for him.
I want the Samuel Alito's Mom's Abortion Clinic lunchbox, and I want it now! That merch is AMAZING!
The uproar is the point.
The Satanic Temple makes it clear its members do not actually worship the devil or believe in the existence of Satan or the supernatural.
But somehow conservative Christians believe that there are huge swaths of people who agree that their religion is 100% correct but worship the weak bad guy character.
(Which is not to mention that there are actually multiple bad guys who got combined, Satan and Lucifer and The Snake were originally different people)
This is a long standing joke - what do you call someone who believes in Satan?
A Christian.
God is omniscient and thus knew exactly what Lucifer would do. Angels don't have free will. Lucifer did exactly what God intended. God wanted Man to have free will. Free will requires the choice between good and evil. Man is the "bad guy" as well as the "good guy".
That last part is intriguing. Do you have any more info that I could read about how/when their unholy trinity was combined into one evil deity?
The wiki article does a decent job. Basically the mentions of him in the texts describe different beings because they were written by different authors for different audiences with much different views. The serpent story has echos of other bronze age ones in that area and the text says as much that El put him there. The story in Job looks like a Cannite legend that got reimagined in Judaism. At some point the people of the region believed in desert spirits that would inhabit people causing them to go crazy and kill other people.
Due to the first exile Judaism started inventing an explanation for why they weren't allowed to freely practice by imagining a being that was opposed to El. Because the pattern had broken. The pattern of the past was: everything fine, Jews sin, god punishs, jess repent, everything fine. However, this time they were trying to repent and weren't able to. Which meant that something was blocking it. Hence Satan. The accuser.
By the time Paul came around the Book of Enoch was popular and to him Satan was a leader of a celestial army of angels. Which is why Paul said that had they known they were killing the son of God they still would have. That were not just following El. Off his writings we see things like Revelations and John where Greco-Roman celestial powers were merged with Satan and Lucifer together.
There was never an idea that someone had 2900 years ago and Christianity is following it. Like all myths it is a combination of different fables, attempts by people to explain their world, and thinkers continuing on a tradition.
I can't comment on Lucifer and Satan but serpent reverence showed up in a lot of ancient matriarchal religions before they were displaced by modern patriarchal ones.
This doesn't apply to only Abrahamic religions but shows up in Greek mythology too. Apollo slaying Gaia's serpent messengers at the temple of Delphi for example.
Gnostic teachings, which are a form of Christianity, see the serpent as divine wisdom (Sophia) and the old testament God as the demiurge (Devil). Jesus as the good God. And Lucifer as the light of reason and not a villain.
But Gnosticism is basically a dead form of alternative Christian belief. So I have no idea what the modern church's take is on these three entities.
Got sources for this? Not that I don't believe you I'm just interested in reading up on exactly what you're referring to.
Short of it is that the concept of Satan didn't exist at the time Genesis was written.
From a more literary perspective, there's nothing that directly connects the serpent in the Garden of Eden, the interlocutor in Job, and the later mentions of Satan in the Hebrew and Greek scriptures (and there's not a lot of direct mentions in the Hebrew scriptures). You can kinda make it work if you read between the lines, but fundamentalists will be the first to say you're not supposed to read between the lines of the bible. To them, you take the word as it is written and nothing else.
Naturally, this rigid reading of the bible doesn't work out so well for their beliefs.
To take the Answers in Genesis article on the subject (just because they're a prominent fundamentalist organization), their reasoning is that the bible shows that Satan can enter into a physical being and control them. Notice that they leave out any reasoning showing that Satan did so in that particular case. He could have, and therefore, he did.
"Well, they are Satanists. They are just lying."
Reading the outrage comments always tickles me lol. Welcome to the point, bitches!
It's a bit frustrating that it doesn't make any of them actually reflect on their hypocrisy though. They just double down on the hypocrisy with no questions asked.
I've been saying it for years, through even the most liberal of us attacking me for it -
It's because this is and always has been the point and the end goal.
You'll almost never reach the truly devoted. But, you can get them to say insane things in front of an audience.
You can't use your technicalities to push your way around and do what you want! That's our whole thing, man!
The Satanic Temple does a little trolling.
As a treat.
It's not trolling though. They teach kids good things.
The Satanic branding is basically the trolling and meant to be provocative, at least that's what they say on their About Us page. That's one reason other (more insane) Satanists hate the ST, because they basically openly admit to appropriating Satanic and pagan imagery in jest which is sacrilegious to "real" Satanists and some pagans who actually believe the symbols have power. It works in the sense the ST is a political advocacy group though because it freaks some Christians out.
Satan accepts everyone
Not his fault that God is picky
Satan doesn't whisper "Believe in me".
He shouts "Believe in yourself".
Satan is rad as hell.
God is the dickhead that puts a dangerous tree in the garden despite knowing exactly what's going to happen. God is the asshole that wipes out everyone (even the animals) except one drunkard and his family because God apparently fucked up again. God is the one who creates a place of infinite punishment for finite crimes.
God is the real villain of the Bible.
Preach
I’m cool with banning satan shit if we ban all other religious shit in politics and law. Fuck your imaginary friends.
The Satanic Temple is an atheistic organization that uses Satan metaphorically, mostly to troll Christians.
DO YOU WORSHIP SATAN?
No, nor do we believe in the existence of Satan or the supernatural. The Satanic Temple believes that religion can, and should, be divorced from superstition. As such, we do not promote a belief in a personal Satan. To embrace the name Satan is to embrace rational inquiry removed from supernaturalism and archaic tradition-based superstitions. Satanists should actively work to hone critical thinking and exercise reasonable agnosticism in all things. Our beliefs must be malleable to the best current scientific understandings of the material world — never the reverse.
https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/faq
As you can see from this uproar, it works quite well too.
Yeah, I know. Good.
That is the exact goal of The Satanic Temple. They would be incredibly happy to have their own symbols removed, as it would mean all religious symbols would be removed from government institutions. They are trying to scare Christians into voting against their own legislation, basically.
The first amendment in the constitution makes it so the government has to give equal rights to all religions, so the Christians can't remove the Satanic symbols without also voting to remove their own.
The Satanic Temple isn't religious.
I know, but they’re using religious pretense in the service of freeing us all from religious oppression.
Thats a complicated thing to say because the ST functions as a real religion in the US which is the basis for why they're able to challenge things in court. If they didn't qualify as a sincere religion their mission wouldn't work, and that "sincerely held" qualification is actually challenged in some cases. Recently this qualification became an even bigger deal when people claimed they had religious beliefs against vaccination. In the past its been applied to people challenging the draft on behalf of sincerely held religious beliefs.
I don't think they're a religion like Christianity though, maybe a pseudoreligion or civil religion.
As someone planning to move to this area soon I want my kiddo involved!
Be careful you don't encourage it, or else they won't want to. :P
People are cats.
The number of adults in the US that think Satan is a literal being is way too fucking high.
It started as an editor using 'adversary' in the place of what was probably the goddess Anat appealing the head of the pantheon to kill the son of the protagonist like in the earlier Canaanite A Tale of Aqhat as an intro into what was an adaptation of the also earlier Babylonian Theodicy in Job.
But we couldn't have a polytheistic holdover, so suddenly there was a supernatural 'adversary' ('Satan') in a story.
Which in turn spawned fanfiction during the prophet ages where they referred to the supernatural adversary of Job.
Then Hellenistic ideas around Hades (both the place and figure) get added into the mix, and we get the Enochian literature about fallen angels, where the guided katabasis influenced Virgil which later informs Dante's Inferno.
Then King James messes up translating Isaiah and the Latin for the morning star (Lucifer) gets mistaken for a proper name, further tying the supernatural adversary to being one of the Enochian fallen angels. And we get Milton's Paradise Lost.
It's all just mistranslations and fanfiction.
And yet millions of people believe it's actually a thing so much so that they freak out at the idea of any references to it as literally being dangerous.
In 2022.
An age filled with things beyond the wildest imagination of those in antiquity dreaming up miracles and wonders.
We're so beyond fucked as a species.
To those people, if there's no Devil then it means all the bad stuff in their heads and hearts is just them. All the temptations are them. All the hatred, including self-hatred is them. There's no Devil that made them do it or think it, no external tempter or defiler to resist. They can't take that.
Well you can't believe Satan is real without believing God is real, and that number is too high too.
Observe:
I just did it.
All I did was was choose to believe a different version of the fairy tale.
For what's it worth, it was a take on the "The Throne Is Empty" mythos, fucking Metatron, always lyin'
I understood some of these words.
But that was fun to read
Could say similar things about the monotheistic Christian God who seems to have originated in Cannanite polytheism. At some level everything is "made up" though and that doesn't prevent it from having power. Just look at race for instance.
There is no way you expect the average person to know this.
I expect the average person to know that there isn't a supernatural evil being controlling the bad things that happen in the world.
ASS Club.
Nice.
Sad that something like this is even needed but the US is full of bigoted hypocrites that want to turn the country into a religious state.
Sad that something like this is even needed but the
USworld is full of bigoted hypocrites that want to turn thecountryworld into a religiousstatewasteland.
Conservatives always want to have a free "marketplace of ideas" until it's something they fear.
...until it's something they fear.
Which, unfortunately, is everything they don't understand, and absolutely for lack of trying.
Yes I love freedom, but not like that.
Of course Tennessee Christians are outraged. The after School Satan Club is most likely way more Christian than they are so there's stiff competition.
good, the more noise they make the more this will spread
Lmao.
Actively missing the point......... "In a meeting with more than 40 pastors and other religious leaders, the district board chair, Althea E Greene, said: “Satan has no room in this district.”"
The kids are alright 😃
They can't without getting rid of all other extra curricular activities & I love that for them.
Not all, right? Just the religious ones I hope.
Usually the way it works if the school district digs in it's heels is, TST sues the district. The district realizes it cannot win in court because there is a staggering amount of precedent and law against them. Then the district itself shutters all after school programs officially. Except of course the teacher running the Christian club invites kids to off campus gatherings that occur after school. Then the district gets sued again.
Low IQ Christians never learn. They must be old dogs.
Watching the Church of Satan get exasperated when they're tagged about this shit on Twitter never ceases to amuse me
Yeah I kind of love how the Satan churches hate each other, CoS basically calls the ST pussies and ST calls the CoS insane.
Is the blue cheese thing in their comparison chart thing real?
Published by The Satanic Temple. That's a very important distinction to make.
Very true.
God bless the Satanic Temple!
People always fall for the obvious troll.
Satanism is to Christianity as Jim's beach day team "Voldemort" is to Dwight's team "Gryffindor"
What do you call someone who believes in satan?
Christian.
Yes, yes, there are other Abrahamic religions... The point is that the only group who actually believe in Satan and therefore are the ones who afford Satan a place in their society are the ones complaining.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, nor prohibiting the free exercise thereof.
Everyone gets to be part of whatever religion they want, Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Nice to read. I'm agreably surprized and relieved the kids are displaying this level of creativity. And all for a cause that does good in ways that are not at all obvious at first sight for so many people who see themeselves in grey zones. My only fear is that going such a point of controversy will provoque violent reactictions where other ways of fighting may not have, and thereby not causing to swap contless more enemies they (or we) didn't need to have. But then again, can anything happen without it being the case?
In the 60s my best friend started the Organization for Atheists or OFA in response to the young christian group in our high school. They even had a chant" OFA OFA OFA goodness sakes!!!
well this is gonna end in violence that gets ignored
Obviously a red herring. The Devil went down to Georgia, looking for a soul to steal.
All hail Satania!
Yep, that's the good stuff. I can hear that laugh in my head lol
If the founders didn't just want to stir the pot, they would call the club "free-will humanitarian anti-authority club".
After a bit of prodding ChatGPT suggests: "Free Spirits for Global Empowerment and Liberty" (FSGEL), which is a million time better then invoking satan, just to get on people's nervs.
Isn't pot-stirring the whole point?
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Highlights religious indoctrination doesn't really belong in schools. I can't really speak to the organization ASSC and what they do, but that's the point of including Satan in school. Trying to make a club for (just an example here) your Jedi church doesn't have the same punch because Jedi haven't been a part of culture for hundreds/thousands of years. Maybe I'm off base here, but it's easier to make a legal argument in court that your religion is real if it's been a part of culture for a while.
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Gives kids who are athiest/nonreligious an outlet away from all the christian stuff. Christianity can feel very oppressive in school, depending on the location. Calling it the "free spirit" club or atheist club isn't enough. Christians tend to go out and find non-believers to bother, so designing your club as a big metaphorical middle finger can help with that. It'll keep the young evangelists out, and it's a reasonable outlet for feeling rebellious.
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Missing from the article is this group's primary, unstated motive: they only attempt to create such clubs in schools that actively promote similar, religious clubs. This tactic only works in schools that have previously demonstrated their intent to promote religion.
Any school can insulate themselves from this tactic by not becoming a church.
If the founders didn’t just want to stir the pot, they would call the club “free-will humanitarian anti-authority club”.
Yes, and?
I don't quite understand, Satan is a contentious figure in Christianity (and maybe other Abrahamic religions? idk, not knowledgeable about it) and it's reasonable to be worried or concerned as an adult about what interests the youth might have. And it really seems the opposition is simply speaking platitudes. They haven't demonstrated 1. it is not a faith, and 2. it causes harm. The folks who are opposed surely can't have their preferred beliefs determine the beliefs of others in areas where it's clear there is not immediate harm.
That definitely shouldn't be allowed no more than Christian clubs. (This seems much worse than a Christian club)
That's the point. Are you aware of The Satanic Temple and their work on the separation of church and state?
If a Christian club is allowed then a Satan club should be allowed. It shouldn't be up to school administrators and politicians to deem which religions are moral enough to benefit from tax dollars. None of them should.
Why is a Satan club worse than a Christian club when we know both belief systems are bullshit?
Satanists: No no no we don't actually worship Satan. We just picked that name to be antagonistic towards christians.
Christians: That's creepy either way.
Satanists: SEE? SEE? I told you they would complain.
Satanists: We picked the name to bring attention to all the things you can get away with if you call yourself a religion
Conservative: I'm not listening! THEY WORSHIP THE DEVIL!
Satanists: See? It's working.
The "After-school Humanist Club" would not be having articles written about it.
It seems like a lot of effort to create a situation with little upside and most certainly, 100% chance of blowback. If you want Christian Nationalist riled up and mobilized, then this is how you do it.
