S.F. bakery won't serve cops, police union claims. Store says it's about the guns, not the cops
S.F. bakery won't serve cops, police union claims. Store says it's about the guns, not the cops
The San Francisco Police Officers Assn. claims that a bakery in the Reem's California chain denied service to one of its officers because he was in uniform.
San Francisco’s police union says a city bakery chain has a “bigoted” policy of not serving uniformed cops.
The San Francisco Police Officers Assn. wrote in a social media post last week that Reem’s California “will not serve anyone armed and in uniform” and that includes “members of the U.S. Military.” The union is demanding that the chain “own” its policy.
Reem’s says, however, its policy isn’t against serving armed police officers. It’s against allowing guns inside its businesses.
Last time I checked "Police Officer" wasn't a protected class you little snowflakes.
veteran status is though in a lot of cases so I would not be surprised if there was movement to take it in that direction
Put down the pipe, son.
They’re not banning veterans though, right? Just guns. Unless veterans are literally guns, but I know plenty of vets that don’t want open carry or unrestricted guns, so I’d say vets aren’t actually guns, and therefore aren’t restricted by this business’s policy.
It could be worse. This shop could react like police officers when someone enters a police station with a weapon.
So fucking what? Police aren't a protected class.
They’re about to be.
They're a minority of the population so they should be.
it's about the guns, not the cops
Honestly would be cooler if it were about the cops
Ssshh. It definitely is wink
For some more context this place, reems, really isn't a bakery so much as a middle eastern take out place. The main store is currently closed down though so the only place they have open is a counter serve food court style place in the ferry building, so the cops didn't get kicked out of the place, they either went to the counter and the cashier refused to serve, or more likely, they saw the new policy online and threw a hissy fit without actually going.
The founder is a Palestinian leftist, so this probably was targeted towards cops/military.
I'd highly recommend going here if your on a tourist trip and end up in the ferry building, not just for the cop hate, but there wraps are great as well.
Even if it were a policy against serving cops, didn't the Supreme Court literally just rule that a business can deny any group?
If you can refuse to serve gay people, you can refuse to serve cops. This shit goes both ways.
Yes because homosexuals could just leave their gay in their car amirite
Right.. why do they have to exist in public.. /s 🧐🤔😭
True, but court would claim the previous ruling was focused on contracted custom services and freedom of speech.
It would be pretty easy for them to craft an argument in favor of letting the cops in, as hypocritical as it may be.
this is what being conservative is all about. There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.
So then the Masterpiece Cake Shop ruling, maybe.
That one might apply better. Same outcome.
Good, normalize rejecting cops.
I've walked out of a restaurant when 4 cops rolled in.
Bring on the down votes but my opinion is this will only make things worse. I think people should judge the police on a officer to officer basis. I work in public service and the majority of cops are really decent people who are trying to help. There are always bad seeds. Even if a cop is on a power trip if you ask them they will help you.
In my opinion the biggest problem w the police isn’t the officers it’s the training and culture. They have their hands tied w ridiculous use of force policies and almost no training. But bring on the hate and call me a fascist.
Edit: biblical service to public service. Jesus has no place in these streets.
It's hard for me to judge them individually cop to cop because literally EVERY.SINGLE.ENCOUNTER I have EVER had with a cop has been a negative experience at best. Every single one. I'm not going to hate on you or call you fascist. Just pointing out it's like saying I've never met THIS wasp before, maybe I shouldn't judge it unless it stings me! Then surprise motherfucker you got stung, whodathunkit.
even if a cop is on a power trip if you ask them they will help you
Fucking bullshit, sorry but not sorry, but you're delusional man. And I'm a 40yo professional white guy in the suburbs! My god, I can't even imagine being black from the hood.
You know every time I've had something stolen and filed a police report I have not even once had my stolen shit returned. They don't even call back after weeks to say "hey we didn't care enough to follow any leads, good luck".
And yet they take every fucking chance they can to write my as many moving violations as possible, whether or not they apply.
The police don't serve the people, never have.
I work in biblical service and the majority of cops are really decent people who are trying to help.
Your inability to see your selection bias and account for it (while claiming to do just that) is beyond staggering.
Like... you're saying the words, but then your overall takeaway proves that despite what you're saying, you have no concept of reality beyond your own lived experience and world view.
I'm not in the ACAB/Defund camp either by any means, but you should either learn to truly acknowledge your bias (and not just pay it lip service), or just fucking own it and stop pretending to have a nuanced and enlightened opinion.
Like...don't try to make yourself sound like you're speaking from any sort of well reasoned position that accounts for the limitations of personal experience and acknowledges the experience of others. Just say, "Hey, the vast majority of cops I've interacted with, I've had no problem with. Therefore I think most cops everywhere are decent people and the tiny fraction that aren't are just an unfortunate and unavoidable, but ultimately acceptable exception that is worth it in exchange for the services police forces as a whole provide for society."
Because that's literally what you're saying.
You're a white guy working and interacting with these cops in a religiously charged setting that already puts you in familiar and friendly territory with them in terms of ideology, race, and gender. These are three huge factors that are all coloring the interaction, and given the closely intertwined threads of American right wing politics with police, religion, race, and gender, every single interaction you've had with them benefits from being on their side in all the major categories that matter. With that frame of reference, you cannot possibly (at least while maintaining intellectual honesty) use your own personal experience as being at all broadly representative of that of the average person in the general public.
It's like showing up to game day in the home team's city wearing the home team's colors and singing the home team's fight song...and then the next day when you see a story about how many of those fans you met were harassing and assaulting fans of the other team, your response is, "Well I interacted with dozens of those fans and they were all really nice to me. Since I have real experience with them, that proves that they're nice people who would never do those bad things. Must have just been 1% of bad apples. But overall, there's no problem with bad fans since they were all nice to me."
Even if a cop is on a power trip if you ask them they will help you.
I was with you until about here. I've seen cops shoo away people in need rather than even deign to give directions. I would say the majority I've seen have been very unhelpful and the encounters that have been nice or cordial have been the extreme minority. It's like their default is power trip mode.
In my opinion the biggest problem w the police isn’t the officers it’s the training and culture.
That's sorta the point that people generally have issues with cops dude. It's the overall culture of shielding of each other from consequences, stoking a "everyone is your enemy"/warrior mentality among officers, bad or lack of training leading to unneeded violent escalation etc.
It's been police departments dragging their heels and throwing tantrums on addressing these issues that have what caused people's dislike of them to grow.
A good officer will have no problem respecting a bakery's no-firearms policy.
It's fine to have a different opinion and you shouldn't be downvoted. If you've had that experience of them it's perfectly valid. There's just a lot of cops who are secret white supremacists who get outed routinely and that's genuinely scary. Cops should get a lot more education than they do in the US.
my opinion is this (rejecting cops) will only make things worse.
Giving them the benefit of the doubt because if you don't they will punish you isn't really giving them the benefit of the doubt, it is a backhanded acknowledgement that if they are not collectively appeased and given unwarranted grace, they will behave badly.
That's not an argument that they're not bullies, it sounds like an acknowledgement that they're bullies and it would be better to appease them
It's wholly within their rights to refuse service to anyone for any reason. I hope they stick to their.. well, I guess "stick to their guns" doesn't really work here but whatever.
If they are a public facing business, they are not within their rights to refuse service to anyone for any reason. There are protected classes, like age/race/sexuality. So if you own a business like a coffee shop, you can't say "no black people." However, police and guns are not protected classes, so I think they should be in the clear legally.
Unfortunately that isn't true. Businesses have a right to refuse service for a wide variety of reasons. Like you said though those protected classes are illegal to discriminate against.
That is why you can have rules, like "no shirt no shoes no service". So in this case it is if you bring a gun you will be asked to leave.
Although now if that store was ever a victim of a robbery I would bet the response time is very slow....
Also the distinction is "no uniforms, no guns" off duty police are still served. It's actually a little closer to "no shoes, no shirt, no service".
As listed in the article some of the employees and regular customers come from war-torn places or have histories of traumatic interactions with police. Hence the ban comes from a place of limiting PTSD reactions.
"Stick to their buns" I guess?
if you’re going to have policies that discriminate against one group of people, then own it, post it publicly,
...McCray said somehow without even a hint of irony.
Hey now, cops aren't all bad. I mean 60% of police wouldn't be caught beating their wives.
60% of chips didn't admit to it, that 40% was a self reported number so 40% were dumb enough to see "do you beat your spouse" and went "uhh duh...yep, everyday!
Congratulations, you found the joke behind me choosing such a specific wording.
Here is a fun fact, they actually ruled that it is constitutional for a police officer to have IQ requirements in hiring out of concern that someone who did not meet the requirement would not obey orders or may have questions about certain orders.
This sounds reasonable except I'm not talking about the IQ being too low, I'm talking about the IQ being too high, some departments will actually limit people from being police officers if they test too high on an aptitude test.
If cops want the bakery to "own" their policy, they they should own their policy of racial profiling
“Reem’s has a deep commitment to uplifting social and racial justice in our communities,” the statement said. “This includes fostering an environment of safety for our staff and customers. In a time of increased gun violence — particularly impacting people of color, youth, and queer people — we believe that maintaining a strict policy of prohibiting guns in our restaurant keeps us safer.”
They don’t want guns on their property. It’s pretty simple. They have the right to restrict guns on their property.
Calling them ‘bigots’ and ‘discriminatory’ is disgusting, because those words mean hating people for inherent qualities that can’t be changed, like skin colour. You can leave your gun and uniform behind and poof you magically aren’t in the ‘discriminated’ group.
Black people can’t leave their skin in their car. See the difference? No? Then you might be a bigot.
e: anonymous downvoters, don’t be a pussy, reply please. That’s the whole point of this forum. Engage or gtfo.
The police complaining about something being bigoted? Are they that blind? Or do they really only care when it effects them...
This is the worst kind of discrimination: the kind against me
The latter, it's the latter.
They're not blind, they just know more forms of abuse than punching their wives.
The right wing very much likes twisting and using the language the left uses against them.
Aa the ban only applies to uniformed and armed cops and not plain clothed off duty ones they seem to be more outraged by the lack of convenience.
They seem to have wheeled out their Victorian fainting couch over the barest hint of being told to respect a PTSD trigger safe space for people who have been terrorized by uniformed and armed people. Oh the bigotry! (snerk)
"Sorry, we don't support that lifestyle"
Thanks for the chuckle.
Even Aragorn and co had to leave their weapons to enter Edoras. Gandalf was a cheeky bugger though.
Police in SF are showin up?
To eat in a bakery? Sure.
If you didn't want to be a bastard, you shouldn't have been a cop.
In a city where you can’t park your car in the street without the window being smashed or have a business without having homeless harass your customers I thought that you might want to be nice to the cops but I guess I am wrong.
Assuming you're speaking from loved experience and not what you heard on Fox News, what do the cops actually do about any of that? They might mosey along and murder the homeless person eventually but they're not gonna stop someone from smashing your window. Most likely case is they just won't respond at all.
Aren’t police unions among those who back politicians that fight tooth and nail for businesses to adhere to their values? I should think that Reem’s would have their full-throated support for refusing service to those who offend their beliefs. I’m so confused.
/smh
Well here's one civil right the cops can't easily ignore. If an undercover buys a donut is that covered by qualified immunity?
It would not be required as off duty cops or non-visble ones are allowed. The ban is only on uniforms and guns which makes sense given thw article states some of the employees and regular clientele come from war torn places or have PTSD triggers around uniformed officers.
Ostracize pigs they are a drain on society. Acab
“will not serve anyone armed and in uniform”
Should this be an "or" statement? Showing up naked with a gun would pass this logic.
[Weird, sarcastic joke] Uniform? But what about the fire department?! Oh wait, they don't carry guns for some reason. Woah, does that mean they don't just show up and gun people down? That's a neat idea, I like that. Maybe more uniformed services should be like that.
[Song reference] But still, fuck the fire department. Dropping by unannounced just to fry your apartment...
I think they intended to include people in uniform but unarmed
Well if the police union said it it's probably a lie anyhow.
Let's be honest, this is absolutely directed at police. Sure, it bans all people with guns but 99% of the people coming in there with them will be the police.
That said, they are free to do that. I think it is a little shitty but that's up to them.
Police are a little shitty, but that's up to them too.
Cops are massively shitty.
I mean, maybe it's just me but I don't like to make sweeping statements about large groups of people. I get it's the thing to do, shit on cops, but all it does is make the few good ones callus and bitter and turn bad. I've seen this with a friend on the force first hand. Most seem like asses TBH but mindsets like this turn the rest who are good shitty too. They feel like everyone hates them but the other asshole cops, so guess what they become...
ACAB
As a non-American trying to understand, why do you feel this policy is a little shitty?
Just waiting for an entrepreneur to set up a table and operate a gun check service.
It's not shitty at all. What a stupid sentiment to hold.
normalize rejecting pigs.
SF recently allowed concealed carry.
"Sorry Madam/Sir, I assume you have a weapon on your person. That is against our policy. We cannot serve you. Please leave the premises."
How about if the union 'owns' that they are murderous bastards that consider themselves above accountability?
Good.
Maybe a better move would be to not serve any gun owner whatsoever. It's their business, do what you like.
That's exactly what they're doing. Did you not read beyond the title?
Sure I did...then expanded on what they are doing, joking that they have the right to limit their customer base, and the $ it brings if they choose to. Doesn't sound like good business to me, but hey, their choice.
Love all the ACAB comments here. If you're all anti-gun and anti-cop, who do you call when someone is in harms way, including yourself? You all talk a big game until that game is on your doorstep.
It's less anti cop, more extreme disagreement with how our policing system currently works. The lack of training, the insanely wide degree of responsibilities, the lack of accountability, etc.. They effectively function as a state sanctioned gang.
Yes, if I end up in a dangerous situation and need a person with a gun to help, I will begrudgingly call the police (and pray they don't shoot my dog) because that's the option we have. That doesn't mean I don't completely disagree with and want to change that system.
ending qualified immunity would do wonders for accountability IMO.
Well first of all, I don't want to call them because they'd shoot my dog
control your dog.
Why even say this out loud?
The whole world is going to shit, and these people are useful idiots. Maintain your weapons, and when the need arises, secure food and resources from them.
agree.
By "harms way" do you mean attacked, or other?
I mean any time you'd normally call the police. A lot of the ACAB people talk a big game until they are faced with a situation where normal people would call the police for help. Personally, I'm all for personal protection. Train yourself and learn how to use self defence and firearms. Don't put yourself in sketchy situations. of course that's not always possible, but thats why you train. for that one in a million time.
Sounds like a good target for a robbery, cause you know the police will take their time getting there.
A childish reaction I totally expect from this corrupt gang.
Sounds like we shouldn't have those police.
No military eh?
Guess I won't be eating there.
Also, with very few exceptions... you won't find armed military people walking around in the civilian area.... so, the rule against armed people is illegitimate here.
I mean, it shouldn't be an issue then. The point is they won't allow armed people in, no matter why they're armed. They don't care if you're a cop or military off duty with no weapons. This is just the union trying to spin it as anti-military/cop. I bet you anything the questions went something like
Nobody armed?
Nope.
Not even military?
Yup.
If you want to wear a little tinfoil, one might suspect they asked it like that just for the excuse to paint them as such.
99% of military walking around are not armed, in fact it would be particularly odd to see anyone but military police walking around armed. Like to the point if I saw that I'd call the military police. Especially off base.
I'm military and I support the decision to not serve us in uniform. I think it's probably a little misguided since most of us are office drones same as anyone else, but it's his store and I wasn't born in the military, it was my choice* to join.
*I wanted healthcare and to pay for college.
The cop said that their policy is to not serve uniformed military, not the bakery. The bakery claims it has nothing to do with being a uniformed officer or military personal, they just dont allow firearms in the building.
Military NEVER, and I mean fucking NEVER take service weapons off base unless they are going to fucking WAR.
Yup. That's basically what I was trying to say.
Guess who just got themselves put on the "do not respond to emergency calls" list?
Side note:
Reem’s says, however, its policy isn’t against serving armed police officers. It’s against allowing guns inside its businesses.
It's San Francisco. Aren't police the only ones allowed to open carry there? So it's just a de facto ban on cops.
Edit: gotta say, I'm confused about the downvotes. I'm pointing out that the police are likely to retaliate. Did I say something that gives the impression I'm condoning that?
Oh no!!!! Who will come and take a report and do nothing after they get robbed?!?!
They won't do nothing, that's slander.
They'll shoot your dog while they're already in the neighbourhood, and that is objectively something.
That's probably for the best.
If they call the cops and they show up, they're far more likely to get shot themselves.
If they would leave people to die in an emergency over donuts then they're disgusting human beings who don't deserve anyone's time of day anyway.
Sounds like cops are allowed if they leave their guns behind, so it's not a ban on cops at all, just cops who insist on carrying their gun more than they keep their body cameras on.
Guess who just got themselves put on the “do not respond to emergency calls” list?
Oh no! Anyway...
It's not like they prevent crime, they show up afterwards, take a report and then you never hear from them again. If you're unlucky, they show up, get spooked, shoot you and lie on the report and still never do anything to help you. What exactly are you missing by having them never show up?
"do not respond to emergency calls" list
Bro everyone everywhere is on that list. Cops don't do anything unless they're forced to or they get to RP Bad Boys
Imagine if those cops were gay! They wouldn't be able to get donuts anywhere!
There should be a law that says for each type of business in a region (e.g. donuts and coffee) you cannot introduce new discrimination that is already done by another establishment -- that way cops will always have at least one place to go.
Sexuality is a protected class. Being a cop and carrying a gun are not.
Discrimination is entirely legal when it's not against a protected class.
Guns don't have a sexual or gender identity nitwit.
