Mod That Makes ‘Baldur’s Gate 3’ Less Gay Gets Nuked After Players Revolt
Mod That Makes ‘Baldur’s Gate 3’ Less Gay Gets Nuked After Players Revolt
Nexus Mods has removed the mod, which erases a canon lesbian relationship by changing one character into a man.
Just to be clear for everyone here, the mod author effectively stated the goal was to reduce diversity.
There are other mods that change gender of characters that state no such thing, which are still up. It's really only the intent here that mattered.
It's mildly interesting to consider that just stating the intent is the key difference. Not so much banning the mod as the modder, I guess.
That's the key part about this and the other times it's made the news I dislike. They don't actually care about the content in the mod, which is why 90% of these hateful mods remain up; those mod authors didn't put the same hate into the description, or the forum, or anywhere other than in the mod which would have to be downloaded and verified by someone to actually know it's a hateful piece of shit. And then when it makes the news when one jackass decides to spout racist/sexist/homo/transphobic shit in the description and get their mod removed, people point out all the other hateful mods that didn't get taken down and wonder why this one is being singled out.
Just remove all of them.
To those that are saying they don't see a problem with this mod. Let me put it to you this way. Instead of a mod that turned one gay woman into a straight man what if it turned one black character into a white character?
There literally was a mod like that in Stardew Valley that turned Demetrius into a white character, and it was rightfully deleted from Nexus mods. If someone has that much of a problem with a character being a different race, sex, gender, or sexual identity then they're clearly bigoted no matter what they say to the contrary.
It's gay erasure, and it's bigotry, plain and simple.
The creator of the mod actually wanted to do just that. He wanted to turn Wyll white, erase all LGBT references, and make Mizhena a trans person who regretted their decision and detransitioned.
I have no problem with a mod that changes someone's sexual orientation, someone's race, someone's species, or just plain removes or adds new characters. Why would I care how someone else is playing a game?
You don't have to care. No one does. No one is blocking this from working.
It's just not being listed on Nexus.
Moreover this mod wasn't giving options to players to choose how they wanted to play, it was changing very specific things and advertising it. Nexus doesn't care to let them use their platform to advertise a mod made for a very specific audience of really shitty people.
It really depends, but in general if you feel that lgbt characters or black characters hinder your enjoyment of the game enough to bother modding them away or different then it speaks about who you are in a way that tells me that I dislike you
Because their target is to reduce diversity
Well there's never anything wrong with customizing a single player game, I fully support Nexus banning whatever they see fit, especially on these grounds. They have no duty to platform content they rightfully see as reprehensible
so many of the replies read like entries to a libertarian contest. and in traditional fashion it seems they forgot to actually read your comment. it’s nice to see a post that understands why the mod is a problem and explains it well, even if so many in the replies seem unable to grasp it.
'the mod is a problem'.
Only if you give a fuck, which is far too prevalent in the world. Could be swapping men for women, blacks for whites, whites for blacks and whatever other combination, the real question is, why do you care who thinks what?
I'm truly for all free expression, the world is too concerned with every fucking thing these days, it's an illness.
Hell, I've seen accusations that the author of this mod made literally that exact mod for BG3 that "fixed" Wyll and his father by turning them white. Shit's disgusting.
If there were a mod that replaced the sex of a straight character you make them gay, would you consider someone definitely a bigot for using it?
Nah, because as straight people we've never actually faced any hardship because of our orientation. Maybe if the idea that straight people shouldn't exist, if one of the major political parties in my country wanted to legalize electrocuting us for being straight, if most of the major religions said we should be tortured to death, if there were people seriously debating about whether we should be allowed to marry someone of the opposite sex, I'd say that mod would be bigoted
There are mods for other games (might be for BG3 but I haven't had time to dig into modding yet) that replace white characters with those of other races, why aren't those controversial? Also it's a single player game. Imagine if you were painting an altered version of a Salvador Dali and someone slaps it off your easel because they find your adding dick tentacles everywhere offensive.
I would say so too but my problem was not my best buddies being gay in general or even flirting with me but the awkwardness of having to straight up reject them. It is not bad to have this as a second hand experience in a game but i can see how people do not like it. I suffered through the awkward feeling of telling Gale off but i wish there was a more clear friendship route to begin with. Again, i dont mind flirting or my friend being homosexual and attracted to me. I just wish i could give hints that this is one sided like i would irl. Not sure in what way the mod did it and i see why it might be taken down but also its not like this mod will vanish because of it.
I suffered through the awkward feeling of telling Gale off
This happens in real life too, though.
And the dialog gives you the options to turn him down, just like in real like you'd have a "dialog option" to turn down a gay person who hits on you. And in real life, it's awkward just like it is in game.
All sorts of uncomfortable things happen in the game. Friends die. Children get murdered. Girls get kidnapped and used as baby incubators. Gnomes are forced into slavery. A hobgoblin fucks a ogre in a barn. As much as people don't want to experience those things in real life, you don't see mods deleting them. Yet people can't seem to figure out that making a special case for the gayness is quite actually gay erasure. They're fine with countless uncomfortable things, buy a bisexual character giving them eyes is too icky to handle??
People need to grow up and stop making excuses for homophobia that they wouldn't make for anything else.
I don't see how this is any different than when straight characters in a game hit on you and you have to reject them. Why does the sexuality or gender of the person change anything when it comes to rejection? You're either into them or you aren't. Make a mod that eliminates awkward rejection moments across the board.
It's a matter of targeting. There are ways to address the change you'd like to see that aren't this focused, give granular control, and permit players to form an experience of their own. It's not just about the mod they made, it's about the mod they could have made but didn't, and that reveals a prejudice.
Lawl all my Stardew people are furries
I’m so gay for Dragon Abigail, I’ll get you all the delicious quartz you ever wanna eat hun uwu
To those that are saying they don’t see a problem with this mod. Let me put it to you this way. Instead of a mod that turned one gay woman into a straight man what if it turned one black character into a white character?
There literally was a mod like that in Stardew Valley that turned Demetrius into a white character, and it was rightfully deleted from Nexus mods. If someone has that much of a problem with a character being a different race, sex, gender, or sexual identity then they’re clearly bigoted no matter what they say to the contrary.
It’s gay erasure, and it’s bigotry, plain and simple.
The best thing about mods is that they only effect the person playing with them. I really don't get the upset over it. Oh, no, someone else might play a version of this game with less gay (or whatever else offends you). I just can't bring myself to have the energy to be angry about how other people have modded their game when it only effects them.
No, they effect everyone. By publishing the mod, the creator told the world exactly how they feel about this subject. If it were the case as you put it, then they'd just create the mod and use it solely for themselves and not tell anyone. It's still despicable, but at least they aren't going to hurt anyone as no-one can stumble across it. Instead, they made a choice and the backlash they've received is a consequence of that choice.
This is hardly news, Nexus has removed mods like these in the past from games like Spider-man and Skyrim. Their rules are pretty straightforward when it comes to stuff like this.
The news is more that the mod existed. And it may not be particularly shocking news but it's still notable when people put this much work into hate.
What makes it hate?
Online news stories primary goal is to gain viewership and "customer reaction" measured by traffic figures. Although I agree this shouldn't be news, it is undeniably a successful news story due to the interactivity it's creating.
As long as people are triggered into clicking on that link, it'll be seen as "what the people want" and therefore "good news story" by the media.
Yes I'm aware I've just described click bait to someone who clearly would understand the concept, I apologise lol
Good, fuck that modder
And nothing of value has been lost. Eff that mod.
I should have snagged it, the model swap was actually pretty good. Oh well, not worth dealing with the drama
I don't have any issues with diversity and inclusivity, and support it however I can.
But I don't really see the problem with this mod? It's a honest question, I've just read the article, and the Nexus mod answer doesn't make much sense to me. I mean there are literally mods that change every character in Skyrim to females, how is that different? (I didn't log in to see the if the mod is active, but I'm sure there's a lot of "we change this character to female" mods for any game).
And more importantly, why not let anyone do whatever they want with their game, and enjoy it however they want? Or was it similar to the Starfield pronouns mod, where the creator went on a hateful rant in the mod description, and acted like a total dick, spewing their bullshit intorelant propaganda? Then, the removal would be understandable. Otherwise, it's just counter-productive and only serves to even more divide people and turn them against eachother, and feels like an unnecessary witch-hunt and a PR stunt.
But please correct me if I'm wrong or missing something, there's probably some context that I don't have.
Nah this mod was making trans people into trans people that regretted it. They planned on removing all the people of colour because of "realism" and do other assorted fuckery. There was a long post about the group that was writing this mod, it wasn't done in good faith.
In other words, there's "let people mod whatever they like" and there's mods that are effectively a statement of an ethos, and not all ethos are worth letting your platform be used to broadcast.
There's also mods that are tools to give players more freedom, and mods that are fixes to correct what the dev sees as mistakes or shortcomings. The difference between "choose what color you want the flags to be" and "the flags are all blue now". The latter is a statement of a belief: "I think the game would be better if all the flags were blue".
The changes in this mod could be framed differently, like "gives player more granular control over NPC gender and sexuality". It could have been done in a respectful and open-ended fashion that doesn't play on harmful stereotypes. It could even be used to make the game "more gay" if the player chooses, then if some players choose to make it all "less gay", so be it. That would be fine.
But that's not what this mod is, and the intent behind it is fairly obvious. There's no reason to pussyfoot around this one with arguments about player freedom, that wasn't why it was made.
This is not the Baldur's Gat devs dashing into the mod maker's house and holding him at gunpoint until he deletes the mod. I'd agree, that would be inappropriate.
What this is instead is the people running Nexus deciding that they don't want to be associated with this kind of content and that they are not willing to host it. If you owned a bar and it started being frequented by neo-Nazis, you'd be perfectly within your rights to kick them out, because you're a private business owner and can conduct it however you like within the bounds of the law.
Your position isn't the "live and let live" idea you think it is, because what you're in effect claiming is that the people behind Nexus should be forced to host content that they find extremely morally objectionable.
I was just surprised why did people find the mod that much offensive. I wasn't aware that the authors intent wasn't to just change one character into different gender, but to effectively purge all diversity from the game, including the racial one.
That changes my point of view, because then it makes absolute sense why you wouldn't allow someone like that on your platform. That was the context I was missing. But if I took the mod at face value, without the rest of the anti-diversity modpack this mod was made for, I still don't see an issue with wanting to change one characters gender for your own playthough, or a reason why to remove such mod from your platform, especially compared to all other "change this character to female" mods that Nexusmods is full of. But given the context, Nexusmods are in the right here, of not wanting to support someone with so blatant propaganda.
Just because the mod isn't on Nexus mod it doesn't mean the creator can't use it or share it, it just means Nexus mod finds it unacceptable and doesn't want to host it, so people can do whatever they want with their game and Nexus mod can do whatever they want with their website.
Nexus is based as hell
It will still be fringe and more inaccessible, so only people who are deeply ingrained in their bigotry and probably have no chance of opening their eyes and having empathy will seek it out, which is a huge win for everyone else.
As was said, the mod author stated the goal was to reduce diversity.
There are other mods that change gender of characters that state no such thing, which are still up.
Yeah, I wasn't aware of the context of the author working on other mods like that, that are purging every diverse character from the game. I totally agree that then it shouldn't be there, I was just taking the mod at a face value and comparing it to other gender-changing mods, which still were there. Given the author's intent and rhetorics, he shouldn't be given a platform to speak.
Nexus isn't obliged to host your files. They're free to have the final say.
I dislike this notion that the characters in the game got to be X. But this is 100% bigotry. That's what makes it not okay. It's not the same as someone going in and making everyone a hot naked lesbian with a single click sex mod. This mod exists as a message and to hurt people.
The creator is free to self host it if they wish. But they may not host it using sites like nexus where they disagree with his message.
That's the facts. My personal opinion is irrelevant. I wish I didn't have to explain it but it's not black and white and can't be taken at face value.
I agree, Nexus isn't oblidged to host your files. I wasn't aware of the authors other mods and goal to purge diversity from the game - which makes it absolutely OK to not want him on your platform, and I agree with removing it.
But when I took the mod at a face value, without this context, I really don't see any problem with it, especially compared to all other gender changing mods on Nexus. Which made their reason not to include it seem like pandering because someone took an issue with it. Now I know that was not the case, and that there was malicious and pretty awfull intent and message behind the mod. But without that, I still think the mod would be OK, and taking it down would be unfair, just because some vocal people took issue with it - which is how the situation looked like from the article. But that's not the case, and I was mistaken, so it's solved.
The last time something like this happened, it was with a mod that removed the pronouns option in (IIRC) Starfield and the reason it was removed wasn't for the content of the mod, but for the content the particular mod's maker put in the description page (bunch of transphobic hate speech). Many news sites reporting on it conveniently left that part of the story out; I imagine this is just another example of that kind of shit reporting and the reason it was removed was because the mod creators were being hateful pricks in the description or forums.
Iirc, that mod also screwed up in removing them and made it so you were always using they/them pronouns.
Or was it similar to the Starfield pronouns mod, where the creator went on a hateful rant in the mod description, and acted like a total dick, spewing their bullshit intorelant propaganda?
yes, this is basically what happened with this baldurs gate mod, and this is why it was removed
I 100% agree with everything you days. I wouldn't install this mod, but I also don't think it should be removed, at least given what I know about it.
I wouldn't use this, but it's fine as long as there another mod for me to increase the gayness of it all.
Increasing the gayness is one thing, removing all of it is queer erasure which is bigotry. Gay people face rejection from 9 out of 10 potential partners every single day. If even one person changes their mind about gay people because they were forced to be rejected by this gay character and it opened their eyes, then that's a huge win for civilized society and equality.
Because the general mindset right now is not liberty of having your own opinion but to push in the opposite direction of what was thought years ago. And that's the problem with extremist thinking it does not care for balance only extreme posture for either one side or the other.
I would hope that a similar mod that gives options to disable certain types of romances would have been better suited. So long as it doesn’t single out the types of romances he dislikes.
I suppose the irony of trying to make it less lGbtq and instead making it lgbTq goes unnoticed by the bigoted creator?
Something something respect the creators vision when I agree with it?
I DEMAND GAYER AND HORNIER (but in reality I'm still on divinity 2...)
If I personally consider Baldur's Gate 3 to be better than cocaine, will I like divinity?
I could google it, but you're right here and as soon as I close this tab I will 100% forget
Also it Google might send me to reddit and fuck that
it uses the same game engine but the combat is a lot less about resource management and more about character builds, the story is good but nowhere near as spectacular as BG3.
It's still one of my favorite games, I can wholeheartedly recommend it. Just don't expect it to be BG2.5, it's a different game
Unlike BG3 where the combat is based upon a TTRPG, the combat in Divinity is designed around Turn Based video games.
All of the abilities have a cooldown instead of being limited resources. Which is difficult to do with pen and paper, but works perfectly on a computer.
The way you do builds is also a lot more dynamic, there isn't really classes as much as there are different fighting styles with abilities which you can mix and match however you want.
The only thing Divinity lacks compared to BG3 is the cutscenes. Which is kind of important in a story based game.
BG3 is my GOTY. Divinity Original Sin 2 is my favorite game of all time. The story/writing isn't as strong in Divinity but the combat is a work of art. I've beaten BG3 twice, I'm in the middle of a multiplayer run, and I'll run through the game at least once more after the major updates are finished being released. I've finished Divinity six or so times and will continue running the game for a long, long time. It's 110% worth your time and money
I want the opposite. No sexuality at all. Only friendships.
I honestly don't care what people are into, but this game is a bit intense, sexually. I'm just trying to get my RPG fix, and all the characters constantly wanna bang my ass, when all I want is to be their Homie...
Less gay?
erases a canon lesbian relationship by changing one character into a man
SnOwFlAkEs
When you put it that way it makes it sound super trans, so I guess joke's on them.
It's good I have eternity client for Lemmy and it shows me my subscribed topics in the main tab
And I don't need to see people shouting at other people so often
There is nothing criminal in creating, using and sharing those mods (as hateful as they are), the modder could have simply said he did it because he felt like it, but the mediaval theming justification is really stupid and inflammatory.
The community reaction is very counterproductive, they have only succeeded in making the mod very visible now. And nexusmods as usual accepting all kinds of horrible mods but censoring only according to drama. All badly here.
You say that but I think that every time this has happened, Nexus has improved in both its standards and clarity on these situations.
And I agree, I’m fine with people making the mods, but they should already know to take them elsewhere. I don’t care if it becomes more popular or less popular or more known. I hope it stays known that Nexus won’t tolerate mods that harm their community. And they are perfect, but props for that.
Lol why can't he just be like "as a straight dude, i don't really want characters of my character's sex coming into me."? That'd be a perfectly fine justification for a mod. The equivalent would apply if somebody wanted it to be even gayer. Shouldn't all this shit be preference anyway?
There is nothing criminal in creating, using and sharing those mods (as hateful as they are)
this isn’t about the law. this is about what’s right and what’s wrong. making mods like this, and allowing them to exist on the platform, is wrong.
Morality is complicated (especially online), there are many ways to interpret things and almost everything is wrong to different degrees for different people. It's easier to appeal to the hard limits of what people have or don't have the right to do.
Morally, one can also say that feeding a troll or arbitrary censorship is wrong. Which is not the same as saying that the platform has no right to block trolls and have content rules.
What makes it hate?
It's just a PR stunt by Nexus mods. And I really hate companies doing PR stunts like these, because you can be sure that they are insincere and most of the time only exploit the diversity and inclusivity as a part of their marketing campaign. It's just like companies waving rainbow flags on their logo for Pride, while donating millions of dollars to anit-gay politicans. .
Seems really dumb to make such a mod. A game that has characters of different orientations and identities is simply a more believable and thereby better game.
However from what I have been reading, the game seems to be overly focused on sex and relationships in general, or is that depending on player decisions?
Edit: I asked an honest question and got downvotes.What the fuck is wrong with some people?
Overly focused is a stretch. You can manage relationships with up to 6 party members, of which you may have up to 1 intimate scene in each of the 3 acts per party member. This is theoretical, and is generally not achievable like that in one playthrough unless you're following a guide. Also, those intimate scenes do not always include sex, they are often just deep conversations.
More importantly, the 3-4 5 minute scenes are spread out over a 60-100 hour campaign lol
My first playthrough was 130 hours and my character had sex once, and I only did that because the situation was so outrageous I wanted to see what happened.
overly focused on sex and relationships in general
I thought you liked believable stories
It’s not really so much focused on sex and relationships, but an earlier version of the game had the romance triggers set too low, so it got a reputation for everyone in the game being excessively horny, plus the internet is gonna internet.
I personally had fun with the triggers for other characters saying they wanted in your pants being originally set too low, because I was playing a horribly socially awkward ranger who lived in the woods far away from people, and she had no idea what to do with what seemed like everyone and their cousin suddenly hitting on her. Poor thing constantly had a voice in her head screaming, “THIS IS WHY I LIVE IN THE WOODS!”
I've played this game for 105 hours on my first playthrough and the relationship and sex parts of it probably didn't take over 30 minutes. Absolutely nothing was forced on me, nothing took me off my path to focus on those, if it happened, it happened in a natural way.
You should not take internet's overreaction of such things as the sole source of truth.
Conversely I found the dialog to be way too much time spend. No dig, just not my preference.
Absolutely nothing was forced on me
Thank you, that is exactly what I wanted to know.
Probably a damn good game, but everything people talk about on the internet is sex 24/7. Makes BG3 sound like a hentai game.
It is the most relationship management heavy rpg I've ever played that's for sure. At times felt like high school simulator with magic
I totally agree with your second sentence, that it makes the game more believable and (at least for me), and BG3 is such an amazing game thanks to their character cast.
However, why would it be dumb to make such a mod? Sure, it's not something I'd use, but it's actually a pretty cool technological feat, given the voices and everything, and it allows you to finetune the game to more fit your preference or fantasy. RPGs are supposed to be about living through your fantasies, and having fun. It's a single player game, why shouldn't people tailor it to their own specific needs and wants?
Of course, if they are being a dick about it, and spewing their bullshit propaganda in the mod description, the I'm all for just banning it.
I have zero issues with any of the orientations of the people in the game but I'm getting bored of all the high school relationship stuff in a game it wish was more focused on the adventure. Like I spend more time in dialogs than I do in combat. I'm not saying the game lacks exploring or combat, I'm saying the balance just isn't quite right for me.
So in my opinion the game spends too much time on relationships of any flavor. But that's just me, many many others love this game exactly how it is, and that's pretty great.
You're getting downvoted from one camp who disagrees that more diversity in a game makes it more "believable" and downvoted from another camp that will also downvoted me for disliking or criticizing the game at all. It's very popular, with good reason, and has generated a very strong fanbase. Suggesting anything is "overly focused" is not gonna fly.
So in my opinion the game spends too much time on relationships of any flavor
That is what I was worried about. I loved playing Divinity 2 because of it´s focus on exploring and combat and never felt that I needed more love/sex/relationships in the game.
You’re getting downvoted from one camp who disagrees that more diversity in a game makes it more “believable” and downvoted from another camp that will also downvoted me for disliking or criticizing the game at all. It’s very popular, with good reason, and has generated a very strong fanbase. Suggesting anything is “overly focused” is not gonna fly.
Some people obviously never learned how to debate. I did not even say that BG3 was overly focused on relationships, I in fact just asked if it was.
