"I shot a guy in the head, but then a different guy moved into the house where he lived, so it wasn't that bad?"
That's great. That's great.
Yeah so it’s not as scary as people think
"I shot 1/4 million people in the head...."
But none of them were deputies!
Except there wasn't even a house left. There was a smoking patch of ground that a different guy moved to.
This is the classic argument against act utilitarianism. It's textbook ethics. Literally, every intro ethics textbook covers it.
Apparently, this is true.
Just WTF.
Mr Musk was talking about nuclear power with the former president when he said people have an unfounded fear of nuclear electricity generation. It is the “safest form of electricity generation”, he argued.
“People were asking me in California, are you worried about a nuclear cloud coming from Japan? I am like no, that's crazy. It is actually, it is not even dangerous in Fukushima. I flew there and ate locally grown vegetables on TV to prove it," he said during the interview on his social media platform X on Monday.
Sensible people: Nuclear power is quite safe, likening it to a nuclear bomb isn't really a valid comparison.
Elon Musk: Nuclear power is quite safe, not all that different from nuclear bombs, which get a bad rap.
Although he is far from a great person and his comparison with Hiroshima and Nagasaki is at best tactless and a downplay of a humanitarian catastrophe caused by the US, he got a point there…
Nuclear energy is by far the cleanest and one of the safest forms of energy generation. We have a problem with the spend fuel, but that is mostly due to the „not in my backyard“-Attitude and outdated informations regarding long term storage. Nuclear radiation is scary but handling it in a responsible way is much safer than perceived. On the other hand, the huge number of respiratory diseases and accompanied deaths are much more diffuse and not directly attributed by the public to fossile fuels. I think „Kurzgesagt“ has a really good video series covering nuclear energy.
It is a little sad that with all the necessary (and important) regulations the building process of a nuclear power plant is really long and public support (at least in Germany) is non existent. It could have covered our butts during the transition from fossile fuels to renewables.
404 that clip not found 🤔
The part that is problematic is lower down on the article:
Hiroshima and Nagasaki were bombed but now they are full cities again," the multibillionaire owner of Tesla, SpaceX and X said.
“The injured were sprawled out over the railroad tracks, scorched and black. When I walked by, they moaned in agony. ‘Water… water…’
I heard a man in passing announce that giving water to the burn victims would kill them. I was torn. I knew that these people had hours, if not minutes, to live. These burn victims – they were no longer of this world.
‘Water… water…’
I decided to look for a water source. Luckily, I found a futon nearby engulfed in flames. I tore a piece of it off, dipped it in the rice paddy nearby, and wrang it over the burn victims’ mouths. There were about 40 of them. I went back and forth, from the rice paddy to the railroad tracks. They drank the muddy water eagerly. Among them was my dear friend Yamada. ‘Yama- da! Yamada!’ I exclaimed, giddy to see a familiar face. I placed my hand on his chest. His skin slid right off, exposing his flesh. I was mortified. ‘Water…’ he murmured. I wrang the water over his mouth. Five minutes later, he was dead.
...
Everywhere, as far as my eyes could reach, all the houses had collapsed, all the trees and electric poles had been broken down. About two kilometres away, around the spot which later proved to be the explosion centre, thick dark smoke whirled up from a sea of yellowish dust.
I remained stunned, completely stunned. The next moment I heard a faint groan, then disconnected words that seemed to come up from the bottom of the earth: "Yuko . . . dead . . . I’m dying . . . don't stay ..." It was my wife, but it was not anything like a voice uttered by a human being: it was a voice squeezed out from the last bit of life in death's grip. "What? Be strong now! . . . Where are you? Where are you?" As if in reply, a pile of tangled timbers moved with a creaking noise. Bleeding all over, my wife stood upright, with our two-month-old baby tightly in her arms.
All around us we heard shouting, groaning, cursing, voices calling father, voices calling mother, voices in search of brothers and sisters. All over the central part of town flames were shooting out as if the earth's crust had been ripped open. And these sorely burnt men and women all in stark nakedness! It was as if our corrupt world had come to an end, giving way to hell. My wife was most painfully wounded. On her whole body were stuck countless fragments of glass, large and small, that reflected pallid lights like a glittering spearhead of a demon. She could see nothing.
I took my wife on my back, and held the baby on my left arm. We walked three hundred metres, stepping barefooted on the debris and broken sheets of glass that went to pieces under our weight, and took refuge on a sand bank in a river where the tide had ebbed. Here we joined hundreds of suffering people, and the sound of the frantic search of parents for their children was heartrending enough to make one giddy.
....
But it wasn't that bad, right?
is this your source? - https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1946/08/31/hiroshima
if not I’m curious to read the full source text please.
Oh wow. They have the full book there?
This is from the book Hiroshima by John Hersey. I remember reading it in high school. It's a great book.
I'm sorry, I just googled for eyewitness accounts, but I can't remember what article I copied from.
Yeah, the bombs’ effects were horrific. It’s absolutely amazing that even that level of devastation was able, in the balance, to save lives.
They did not save any lives, that is a completely made up invention. In fact Imperial Japan cared little about the atomic bomb, and even if a land invasion had become necessary, the USA had made a deal with the USSR to invade on land.
This was the real reason for the bombings, not to beat Japan into submission, which Roosevelt's deal with the USSR for a land invasion ensured, but to show the USSR the destructive power the US held. Truman was a staunch anticommunist, and refused to let the USSR play the part Roosevelt negociated in a land invasion.
It was a war crime with no benefits at all except to show off to the USSR, who would develop nukes themselves 4 years later anyway. An absolute tragedy which proved to be entirely useless.
Did he just say the Atomic bombs were not that bad??? The Fucking ATOMIC BOMBS?!
Can we just drop one on his house now?
This is the same guy who told Steven Colbert he wants to nuke the Martian poles.
To which Colbert replied, “Are you SURE you’re not a supervillain?”
That was in 2016.
I didn't want to take this at face value without context so I found when they discussed this. Check around 1:17:00 in this video.
https://youtu.be/lfBQoWxQaEM?si=6Ev6rx62KESH-HgR
And yeah, he did say exactly what the OP states. So... yeah.
To give the absolute benefit of the doubt, I could say they were referring specifically to nuclear fallout rather than the initial explosion, as a full on explosion is less likely in a nuclear plant emergency. But even assuming it was just an incredibly distasteful way to reference that, there are still thousands of deaths and even more injuries/illnesses associated principally with radiation poisoning.
This is not to say I'm against nuclear energy, but by god we've got to have more careful consideration than this.
Edit: As a bonus, Musk talks about his views on global warming around the 1:10 mark. The issue with greenhouse gasses is, uh... making it hard to breathe?
Musk is not that bright. He pretends to be smart but just throws money at smart people and then acts as if he is actually the smart one. But he's just a dumbass with apartheid money.
For more context: hes comparing nuclear energy disasters like chernobyl to the bombings of japan, saying that because those cities recovered therefore people are wrong about chernobyl still being uninhabitable and that people shouldn't be so scared of nuclear energy. Hes not saying bombing cities isnt so bad in general, just that its not as bad as how "(((they)))" say it is at chernobyl. Nevemind the fact that even if chernobyl was able to rebound it still would've been a major and tragic disaster!
This actually perfectly demonstrates his lack of knowledge and ability to perceive himself unduly as an intelligent person because of his financial success. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were able to rebuild and the nuclear fallout was short-lived because the bombs were detonated miles above the ground to maximize their immediate devastation, while the chernobyl reactor exploded on/in the ground and there is still uncontained radioactive material within the compound because it is basically impossible to clean up.
Also, the comments on that video are depressing.
I haven't watched the video - so I'm going on what is said above, but its like these billionaires are not seeing people as human. They see that after Hiroshima people live in the city but cannot understand that those people weren't fungible. We didn't replace them - they are different people.
Two other small points, but first a caveat - I'm very pro civil nuclear power.
It simply isn't possible for any nuclear power plant to explode like a nuclear bomb. That can't happen - like my car contains an engine but can't fly like a plane. There have been nuclear leaks and chemical explosions in nuclear plants - these are bad. However, they are very different things from what happened to Japan.
Modern nuclear weapons would have much higher yields and probably fallout. Here's a terrifying tool for the morbidly curious:
I feel like Musk needs to meet the Elephant’s Foot so he can understand why Chernobyl is not inhabitable
Meanwhile the fallout from hiroshima and nagasaki is mostly disappated by now.
I listened to a bit of the interview and it's just insane nonsense, trump is ALL over the place with his topics, calling folks losers as a child would. But what was really odd was trump had this lisp almost like he had too much saliva in his mouth. It was gross and resembled that of an old man rambling incoherently
The lisp is probably loose dentures. After all, Trump IS the oldest presidential nominee in US history. Come to think of it, that explains the incoherent ramblings also.
It was just a boiler plate Trump rambling, but with a hype man.
resembledan old man rambling incoherently
Actually unhinged lmao
Just some numbers to put into relation :
| Casualties |
Hiroshima:- 90,000–166,000 killed
- 80,000–156,000 civilians
- 10,000 soldiers
- 12 Allied prisoners of war
Nagasaki:- 60,000–80,000 killed
- 60,000–80,000 civilians
- 150 soldiers
- 8–13 Allied prisoners of war
Total killed (by end of 1945): 150,000–246,000
Source: Wikipedia - Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki
Hiroshima:- 90,000–166,000 killed
80,000–156,000 civiliansAnd modern nukes are SIXTY TIMES more powerful than the bomb dropped on Hiroshima.
Not just that, but far more of them. And also missiles that consist of dozen of smaller warheads inside
And these missiles can travel to literally any place on earth, no matter where they started, as they follow a sub-orbital trajectory into space
And then, in the aftermath of the decision to wipe those cities off the map, the United States said "That worked great. Let's make thousands more of those."
This country is vomitous.
Well, the US and every other 1st world country. Nobody wants to be the guy without nuclear weapons when the nuclear war starts - the ones that can't defend themselves would be easy first targets. That's what the cold war was all about - 2 countries, each just waiting for the other to drop the bomb they're sure is coming eventually.
People worship these shit stains, can you believe that?
To people like Trump and Musk Nazi labor camps are just a good example of an efficient workplace.
Everyone got showers, I don't know what the big deal is. I've seen pictures, have you seen the pictures? All of those people were in great shape. My doctor says I'm as healthy as someone half my age, but I'd kill to be in as good a shape as some of the people in those pictures.
"Not as scary as people think"
You can still see buildings standing. No big deal.
Musk: They all got to make new better houses too since we opened all that space so there was profit and improvement! We really did them a favor to be honest.
Great, really love to see the consent being manufactured for a lil nuclear war! Just a limited engagement bro, just a couple of nukes bro!
Damnit, it's tough but I just don't think dying in a nuclear holocaust is worth it to know that those dumb fucks will also suffer and die.
Just have a limited nuclear exchange, as a treat
No boots on the ground!
As Americans get more belligerent and less rich, it's only a matter of time before we roll out our archaic nuclear arsenal and see what still works.
After all, better to launch a nuclear strike on our enemies than let them win
Lets just ignore the increase in cancer in the survivors. (https://www.rerf.or.jp/en/programs/roadmap_e/health_effects-en/late-en/cancrisk/#:~:text=Tumor registries were initiated in,(10.7%25) (Table).)
And that there was a massive and expensive undertaking to rebuild hiroshima and nagasaki, who were lucky to only end up with short acting radioisotopes, unlike places like chernobyl. (https://davidson.weizmann.ac.il/en/online/askexpert/recovery-time-nuclear-disaster)
Both of these dudes are idiots.
Both of these cunts need to be launched into the sun.
Imagine that, 80 years later it's all rebuilt!
That's great. That's great.
I've been to the museum at Hiroshima. He can fuck off.
Please ignore them. Next.
Just two idiots thinking they've got it all figured out.
Two of the most influential men in the world right now.
An inspiration to crackheads everywhere.
This is similar to what kept coming to mind while listening to it last night:
“This is a former POTUS and the richest guy on the planet, and they’re both so… dumb”.
Blows my damn mind man.
People are replaceable objects to these things
Calls himself an anime fan and he's never watched Grave of the Fireflies.
So, at one point we wanted Tesla cars, powerwalls, and tiles. All of that went right out the window. So two cars and full solar setups for three houses...poof. Unfortunately we still have Starlink due to work requirements, but as soon as we don't need it, it is going right back out.
On the one hand, nukes bad. But on the other hand, the last Godzilla movie was fantastic. So, you know...always a silver lining.
He didn't. Right? Not even that shithead could say that? Right?
i think they’re a little different now…
We can rebuilt. This is but a scratch
Your arm’s off
weird
Musk is doing a speedrun to reach Trump levels of lunacy.
This image removes the bit of important context that they're talking about the safety of nuclear power. Elon is trying to argue that lingering radiation may not be as much of an issue as people may currently understand it to be. So, when talking about the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagaskai, he's trying to point out that even cities that were vaporized by an atomic blast can potentially be livable, and even thriving, within a human lifetime.
That being said, I would argue that there are far better ways to go about arguing in favour of the safety and efficacy of modern nuclear power plants without having to try to paint the horrific atrocity that was the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which have been reported to have killed approximately 200k people (civilians and military alike) in an instant and caused many thousands of later deaths due to burns and radiation poisoning and cancer and any number of other injuries caused by the blasts, as "not as bad as you think".
I'd argue that the great many strides that have been made in engineering and science to develop safe means of operating and maintaining nuclear power plants and the safe means of disposing and managing waste is a much better platform to start from for arguing in favour of nuclear power than the horrific accidents that have happened over the years which have themselves allowed us to gain the research necessary to ensure the current level of safety.
These are mistakes to be recognized, honoured, and learned from — not mistakes to be downplayed.
The lingering radiation is quite different between a nuclear bomb and nuclear power plant meltdown, one with an estimate of 1 to 5 years, and another with an estimate of 30 years. So it's kinda apple and orange, both are fruits, but it's like different species.
That's a good point! I hadn't thought of that. One note is that perhaps a "dirty bomb" might be more similar in effect to a nuclear power plant accident. But that's mostly just a guess, and is, ofc, highly dependent on many factors.
What a goddamn Jerk-Off
The two of them should take a rocket to mars together
Sociopaths view other people as replaceable interchangeable meat puppets. They don't value human life. Our society will not improve until we remove sociopaths from power and make it impossible for them to pursue it.
They were talking about radiation
Oh well, in that context, totally not two out of touch tower goblins, nvmd!
Yeah yeah.
