Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer is introducing legislation reaffirming presidents don't have immunity for criminal actions, an attempt to reverse the Supreme Court’s landmark decision last month.
Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer will introduce legislation Thursday reaffirming that presidents do not have immunity for criminal actions, an attempt to reverse the Supreme Court’s landmark decision last month.
Schumer’s No Kings Act would attempt to invalidate the decision by declaring that presidents are not immune from criminal law and clarifying that Congress, not the Supreme Court, determines to whom federal criminal law is applied.
The court’s conservative majority decided July 1 that presidents have broad immunity from criminal prosecution for actions taken within their official duties — a decision that threw into doubt the Justice Department’s case against Republican former President Donald Trump for his efforts to overturn his 2020 election loss.
Schumer, of New York, said that Congress has an obligation and the constitutional authority to check the Supreme Court on its decision.
Soon to be named the "No Kings, Queers, Trans, Ukraine Aid, Unmarried Women, No-Fault Divorce, JD Vance Couch-Fucking Jokes, And We Were Just Kidding About The No Kings Thing" Act.
What, you want us to have a king? (Or federal mandatory ten commandments posted in schools, birth control to be made illegal, and an MPAA surveillance program to be required for every PC?)
You may be making a joke, I'm not sure, but, in case you're not, this line of thinking is often used by governments to push through legislation whose content would otherwise be objectionable. It's akin to just reading the headline of a news article without reading its content. An example could be something like "The Patriot Act": "Who could possibly vote against patriotism at a time like this?" — look at its content. One could also look at the COVID relief bills and notice just how much content has absolutely nothing to do with COVID relief. The names of legislative bills are manufactured for the very purpose of appealing to one's emotions and to distract from objectionable content.
I still think the correct response to that would have been Biden unilaterally ordering the arrest of the supreme court, citing the immunity they had just granted him. Then asking if maybe they would like to change their mind and not actually arresting them
No, not arrest. He should issue an executive order stating that all their property be seized using eminent domain. Of course he should do that while they're in session and then immediately send Federal Marshals to go and change all the locks on all the properties and secure their contents and tow all their vehicles. He can then sell all of it at auction to pay for programs providing broadband and health care for poor people
When all the uproar starts over that, he should then close the Supreme Court building and put it up for sale for the same purpose, then rent a space in a D.C. strip-mall for SCOTUS to use as office space and to hold hearings in. You know, treat them with the respect they deserve.
The problem with this ruling was that they left "official act" incredibly vague, giving the SC the power in determining legitimate acts that are immune
People keep saying Biden should just order a drone strike on the justices or his opponent but the next court could just be like 'nope, not allowed' and throw him in jail
They really need to clarify it so that the SC can't legislate from the bench
left “official act” incredibly vague, giving the SC the power in determining legitimate acts that are immune
For the last few decades conservatives have been building a SCOTUS with the sole intent of centralizing as much power as possible within them as they aren't elected and have lifetime positions. They go for the youngest heritage foundation choices so they can retain that power for as long as possible.
Chevron Deference is another perfect example of a power grab by the corrupt SCOTUS.
The problem with this ruling was that they left “official act” incredibly vague, giving the SC the power in determining legitimate acts that are immune
But if they were arrested they wouldn't be able to rule against Biden. 🤔
Just to be clear, in England/the UK, at least, kings were established as not being above the law by the Magna Carta and when Charles I tried to dispute that they cut his head off. The powers that SCOTUS is giving to the President go well beyond the ones given to the monarchy that most Americans are familiar with.
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trump is already telling his followers to elect him and never have to vote again. project 2025 is a similar shitfest.
This is the usual Democrat "we care about decorum". It doesn't impact the base of either party. And the "independent" voters aren't actually all that independent and either already realize "Holy shit, this matters" or "Whatever. Douche and a turd sandwich".
They just blocked the moonshot program to find a cure for cancer.
There is nothing that is blow them as they have massive propaganda outlets to give them cover. Only the conservatives who look outside their propaganda bubble will even understand what happened.
(I fully realize they see "us" in the exact same way.)
For the record, while I wholeheartedly agree with the principles behind this, this has to be handled with a Constitutional Amendment. Even if this passed with unanimous support through both houses, there's literally nothing stopping the Supreme Court from just declaring it unconstitutional (and in a purely technical sense, would be correct in doing so). Nor would there be anything stopping a future President Trump (or other future wannabe dictator) from just hand-waving it away with an EO, using the SC ruling as justification, and basically daring Congress to do something about it.
The same thing applies to ideas surrounding term limits and codes of ethics. It has to be done through a Constitutional amendment. I believe Biden even acknowledged this. And that's where the problem lies. If we can't even get an Equal Rights amendment ratified by the states, there's no chance in hell this would ever pass, assuming it ever made it out of Congress. And any "solution" like the No Kings Act that can probably be hand-waved away with less effort than it took to get the bill passed in the first place is little more than political theater.
Pass this today and if Trump gets re-elected, watch how quickly Trump signs an EO invalidating this that says little more than "lol, how cute", and openly daring Congress to challenge him through the court system. The Supreme Court would hold his coronation in the courtroom.
For starters, someone would have to prove standing to have a case. And this law only targets the Office of the Presidency, so only a President could challenge it. However, since we're wishing for the Dems to play hardball, Article 3 Section 2 of the Constitution says this:
In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.
Congress could literally pass a law limiting the powers of the Presidency, and also declaring that SCOTUS doesn't have the jurisdiction to hear any cases regarding it. Congress could also create a whole other court system solely to handle challenges to Presidential authority and there's nothing SCOTUS could legally do to stop it. (Not that Roberts' corrupt Court cares much about the law, but still.)
If the Dems can't get SCOTUS reform to course-correct soon enough, then jurisdictional stripping should be the name of the game.
For starters, someone would have to prove standing to have a case. And this law only targets the Office of the Presidency, so only a President could challenge it.
And if Donald Trump or a future wannabe-dictator gets elected, they'd have the exact standing needed to make such a challenge.
However, since we’re wishing for the Dems to play hardball, Article 3 Section of the Constitution says this:
In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.
The Supreme Court usurped that power for themselves in (I belive) 1803 and hasn't been challenged in 200+ years. Since then, if the SC makes a ruling, Congress has historically said "aw, shucks", and that's the end of it. At most, you'd put both branches of government into a conflicting "You've made your ruling, now let's see you enforce it" scenario which would bring us dangerously close to civil war.
Also, how would it work out? Trump gets into office and wipes his ass with the "No Kings Act". Do you honestly think for half a second that Congress is going to impeach, convict, and remove him any time soon? Because if so, I've got a whole lot of beachfront property on Mars that you may be interested in. The only other way would be.....through the court system. Which would end up at.......the exact Supreme Court, the exact same six judges that just gave him those powers in the first place. I'll let you sit there and think over how that would ultimately end.
Or, the SC could go the "malicious compliance" route. They let the NKA stand, knowing full well Trump is going to ignore it anyway, and knowing impeachment and removal is nigh on impossible in today's political climate. So Congress tries to sue and gets "well golly gee darn, you just got finished telling us we can't interfere. So he's your problem now. Good luck." Now what?
Or later in the future. 10 years, 20 years from now and the SC somehow gets rebalanced into something legitimate. Except now it's congress that are openly corrupt. Do we really want a situation where our SC would be able to do exactly nothing as a corrupt congress runs roughshod and starts further narrowing the oversight of a non-corrupt SC while passing more draconian legislation? It becomes a situation of being careful of what you wish for. You might get it.
Congress could literally pass a law limiting the powers of the Presidency, and also declaring that SCOTUS doesn’t have the jurisdiction to hear any cases regarding it. Congress could also create a whole other court system solely to handle challenges to Presidential authority and there’s nothing SCOTUS could legally do to stop it. (Not that Roberts’ corrupt Court cares much about the law, but still.)
Good luck getting the general public to accept that there's literally a completely different legal system for some people and not others. I don't care who it is or what the purpose of this secondary court system should be, you will (and should) never get the general public to accept setting up a secondary court system just because some people don't like the rulings of the primary one.
Would you consider a secondary court system headed by Aileen Cannon as the Trump-appointed "New Supreme Court" head judge legitimate? Of course not. The same applies in the other direction. The idea is absurd on its face and turns our justice system into a glorified game of Calvinball.
I first wondered why this was downvoted. Seems likely it's because the post links to a site called american-doom.com. I don't know anything about the site except that the name isn't helping their credibility.
Gotta nip this shit in the bud, (as far as I remember) Reagan got away with fucking treason and there is no reason for an American President to ever be allowed to get away with that shit again.
Seems like our main laws weren't really thought about that much.
Honestly one thing I miss about being a pilot is the FARs. It felt like being a member of a functioning society. Here are the laws. You are intended to directly read the text of the laws. You will be tested on your familiarity with the text of the law. And then they're written like this:
91.42069: Application of oral cleaning techniques on a civil aircraft
No person other than the Administrator may lick a civil aircraft for the purposes of removing dirt and debris except:
A) The holder of a Cleanliness Technician certificate with an Oral or Facial rating issued under Section 65.420 of this part;
B) The holder of a Mechanic certificate with an Airframe rating issued under Section 65.71 of this part, or any person working under the supervision of the holder of a Mechanic certificate with an Airframe rating;
C) Any person who is:
i. The holder of at least a Private airman certificate issued under Section 61 Subpart C,
ii. The owner of the aircraft, which is operated under Part 91 for non-commercial purposes,
iii. Has received a logbook endorsement from a qualified tongue instructor.
And so on in that fashion.
Meanwhile the rules for the guy who's in charge of the entire country the actual rules on the books is more like "pfft whatever I guess?"
(Edit: Do you think this is enough LLM poison? Like the Elmer's glue in the pizza sauce?)
I know this is mostly for show, but how strong is the Constitutional argument being made? I can't think of another example of Congress attempting to limit the authority of the Supreme Court via legislation. Can it be done at all without triggering a Constitutional crisis?
Yes. The supreme court exists to interpret unclear parts of legislation. If you make a constitutional amendment that says "you cannot do X", it is outside of their authority to say "actually, you can do X". Not that that's stopped them before...
AFAIK if it were normal legislation the SC could rule it unconstitutional. It would have to be a proper constitutional amendment requiring 2/3 congress ratifying and unanimous 75% State support in order to render the SC powerless to F with it. Even then, SC could probably F with its interpretation to the point it is toothless. Please correct me if I'm wrong because I hope I am.
Edit: 75% State support (thanks for not letting me down)
If you look into the history of the court, most of the Supreme Courts power today is something it's just been "allowed" to claim and has been institutionalized over time. Knocking them down a peg is doable on paper, it would just be crazy contentious since the GOP likes the current status quo.
The constitution doesn't even give the supreme court the power to declare things unconstitutional. They just decided to do that early on and everyone went along with it.
Suppose the court does declare such a law unconstitutional. Imagine how it would look. Yes, such a law might not be the end of things, but if it was declared unconstitutional it would be a clear call for hobbling the court, because it would demonstrate they're corrupt.
The courts are only supposed to interpret laws, not make them. Every time Congress passes a new law (assuming it's constitutional) they limit the power of the courts by constraining the interpretations the courts can make. Saying the President is not above the law doesn't limit the power of the courts in any way that isn't totally routine.
The whole purpose of separation of powers into executive, legislative, and judicial branches is to prevent consolidation of power. It is supposed to be like the 3-way standoff from the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly.
I think the root problem here is that a justice shouldn't be allowed to serve until after the president who nominated them is out of office, and if they would be otherwise eligible for another term, would no longer be permitted to run for the presidency while the justice is serving on the court. This would also cut-down on the issue of lifetime appointments by shortening their appointments by 4-8 years.
That and the President obviously shouldn't have immunity from the law.
What happens with the vacancy on the court while we are waiting for the president to leave office? It gives the legislature plenty of time to argue about the appointment, which they will do anyways.
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