I believe you can still get "dumb" flatscreens, but they're getting rare, and they cost at least hundreds more than their "smart" brethren. So of course those sell very slowly.
The older I get the more I miss the sheer freedom that was built into our daily lives back when technology was just a notch or two less advanced. Phones that stayed trapped on their wall, not in your pocket, tracking you. TVs that were made of dumb stuff that could still pull free content from the air. You had to be part of a special "Nielson family", fully set up with a little tracking box and all that, for the TV to tell anybody what you were watching.
People expected you to basically fall off the earth for 8 hours at work, and didn't expect to contact you for less than a housefire-level emergency, which meant you spent most of the day free, and not just while you were at work. Nobody blinked if you stepped out for the evening to go shopping and could not be contacted for hours. Now people end up in screaming arguments because they didn't answer that text fast enough. It's misery.
I had a shock the other day, watching some YouTube short featuring a young woman (an adult, not a minor) complaining humorously about her mother, who always knows where she is, and thus has all sorts of unwanted opinions on her location. Mother always knows because of an app called Life360, which is basically the kind of spying app that an abusive spouse would hide on your phone. But it's not hidden. You force your children to install it on their phones. It's a leash. So now this adult woman, who of course cannot quite afford to leave home, because economy, cannot simply delete this spying app from her phone without consequences and arguments, so she has no privacy in her movements, from anyone, never mind the government and such. Never mind what actual minors are now putting up with.
We have officially left the era where the adults pissed and grumbled about them damn kids wanting them damn phones they don't need, and we are now in the era where some kid has absolutely been beaten with a belt because he tried to leave his phone in the bedroom and slip out of the house in privacy.
Things like Life360 are normalized among children and parents, so other people will now expect to track you and treat a refusal of tracking as a violation of trust, and probably a sign that you are elderly, thus your rights are becoming debatable.
Again, 5 minutes ago this was evil shit that abusive spouses snuck onto people's phones, suddenly, it's normal, and people will just expect it.
I guess the ongoing shock is that we expected Big Brother to somehow slap a shackle on our necks that we can't take off, but this is all worse. This is putting the shackle on your neck, every morning. It doesn't even lock. You could, theoretically, throw it into the lake at will. Nobody would stop you. But you don't. All the chains are made of other people. The whips at your back are the opinions of children, and what they think is normal. The surveillance cameras do not loom from posts in the sky, no. They're in every pocket. They're much harder to hide from than a security camera ever would be.
I hope I'm just melodramatic, or something.
Nearly hucked my Vizio out last night as I discovered that between last football season and today they have hidden the broadcast channels I receive with my antenna, in their "Free+" offerings and no longer show the channel number when you rotate between them.
This also means that when you choose "Antenna" from the input menu, you get around 15 seconds of black screen while it loads an informative slide about the change and then demands you press the OK button to finish loading their program
Then, to change the channel you must open their fiddly "broadcast guide" and use it to choose the channel you want to watch (after 15 second loading delay for the guide and another 5 second delay once you've picked a channel.
To change the TV from the Nintendo game to Fox took me 10 minutes. Then I realized Fox was showing the Packers game and I needed CBS and it took me 5 more minutes to find the menu again and find CBS.
Just last February this exact same action took maybe 20 seconds? Turn TV on, change input to Antenna, flip channels manually.
The most egregious action I've seen was from a Vizio smart TV I bought several years ago. It shipped with a simple remote control, and a tablet with a control app preinstalled. One day I turned the TV on and was notified that in order to use the updated UI I would need to reach out to support to order (and pay for!) a new remote that had additional buttons.
I hope everyone reading this knows that you can just not connect a "Smart" TV to the internet. Leave it as a "dumb" TV.
Get a separate device like a Roku or AppleTV or Amazon Fire or whatever. The garbage hardware that TV manufacturers slap inside a TV so they can advertise its "smart" features will always be inferior to a purpose built external device.
To say nothing of the security implications of having an unpatched probably unsupported IoT device running on your network for years.
This is the future that Stallman warned us about. They mocked him and said it didn't matter. It's not going to get better until everyone stops buying TVs with spyware built in.
Vote with your wallets or quit bitching. Self hosted is an option these days. But that means not being lazy. And people are really lazy.
We have the burdon of knowledge. We know too much. We were there when a TV turned on and you were presented with channels. Some fuzzy some clear. Sometimes your had to wiggle the antenna. The point is, there is a generation that has never known that. They have only seen a smart tv. They don't know the greener grass. TV makers are waiting for us to die and the next generation to just accept their shitty product as normal. I hate it. I hate it so much.
I tried to find the article, but of course it is lost to the anals of the internet. (Yes, I know what I said). I saw an article a couple of years ago about how there was a push in China that would use the built-in cameras in smart TVs to watch how many eyes were looking at the screen during rented features and charge extra if there were more than some small threshold of people watching it. I think 3 people were allowed for a single rental price and it would be charged again if more than that watched.
This is likely coming for us. Also... Yo ho ho.
Link to the original toot
Some years ago around the advent of smart home devices I bought a huge fullhd Hisense tv for cheap. It has zero smart capabilities, and essentially acts as a big second screen for my computer, and I couldn’t be happier with it.
I am scared once it is time to replace it for something more modern I won’t be able to find one without all the smart crap I don’t use and don’t want.
Bloatware, adware and over reliance on software/complex electronics has ruined a lot of the experience with consumer electronics. Almost everything is festooned with half assed processing units for relatively pointless non-sense. Some of its useful, much of it over or under built. I think we have a big market correction on the horizon, it's currently over saturated with marginally useful junk and a definite market exists for upgraded simple electronics.
I've had a Vizio "smart" TV for about 3 years. It is my first experience with a smart TV and it has been a massive pile of shit since day one. Most recently it has decided to show a black screen every time I turn on the Nintendo Switch. In this state it does not allow me to do anything but turn it off. So I have to turn it off, turn it back on, go into settings and restart the TV. It will then work for a single play session, but as soon as I shut the Switch off I will undoubtedly have to go through this same process the next time I want to play.
This is only the most recent issue I've had with Vizio's garbage ass software. To those saying to just unplug it from the internet, trust me when I say the solution is not that simple. It was even worse before any updates, but with each update they break something else. There is no "good" software version to leave it at.
They also spy on you and know what you watch, even if it's not played from their apps and is just a raw display input. https://www.consumerreports.org/video/view/electronics/televisions-streaming-media/4151762767001/your-smart-tv-may-track-what-you-watch-and-say/
In my country you are charged a license fee for the privilege of owning a tv. That's why I always only had a PC attached to a monitor instead.
Nowadays that is replaced with a dirt cheap orange pi running libreelec (Kodi) which also runs pi-hole in the background for all of the other devices on the network.
The setup is a bit of a hassle but it's a vast improvement on the interface and functionality of friends "Smart TV" experiences in my opinion. I even set it up to work with an old TV remote as the pi has IR built in, although there are phone apps to do remote control also.
No Vizio or Samsung.
I got a Sony and I'm glad I did. It seems to do what a smart TV should do. The apps I use are first, the shows I'm watching are suggested. It works seamlessly over HDMI with all my other hardware (sound bar, Blu-ray, consoles). They took the beautiful LG OLED display and made it look even better. It has a super minimalistic style, the android OS is unobtrusive, and the remote feels nice in the hand.
Getting a dumb TV with an Apple TV box has been amazing.
No ads, just turn on, and play.
Of course you'd think "ew Apple". I did but the Apple TV box is simply the best streaming device available right now. The only thing it can't do easily is sideloading and VPNs, for those the Shield is still king.
I buy TVs with Android TV built in because the freedom is great. I love I can install APKs, and generally they have every app that Android has. Whereas Roku doesn't even have an official Twitch app.
Despite that, my fucking GOD they're slow. Both my $2000 and $650 Android TVs are such a fucking lag fest. Even trying to pause a YouTube video is such shit.
They both run Android TV 9, despite Android TV 12 being out, and 14 in beta.
My CCwGTV is a lot better, but I only use that on my non smart TV because I hate juggling remotes.
Still wont stop buying Android TVs, though. Roku is so empty, those TVs with their own built in OS have even less apps. My sisters $5500 OLED TV only has Plex, no Emby. Which is insane. I think her TVs app store has a total of like 20 apps?
Twitch updated in January with a shitty UI that lags. I just disabled updates and installed an older version of the app via APK. That's the benefit of Android TV.
EDIT: also can we please get some people on the Android TV custom ROM scene? It's weird to me that NO TVs have any sort of custom ROM or rooting. You'd think they would?
I have two TVs. Both are max 1080p. I am absolutely fine with that. One is not a "smart" TV. The other I only turn on when I'm using Airflow, which the TV boots directly into with its built-in Chromecast, skipping the "smart" bullshit. I will use these TVs until they break or there is some major change where they become totally obsolete like CRT TVs.
My 2013 Highest End Samsung was pretty much E-Waste three years later. 80% of the Apps broken, no new Apps for new services.
UTTER BULLSHIT.
I plugged in a FireTV 4k which was on Sale for €25. Perfectly supported since many years. TONS of software, channels and so on. Best buy ever.
When I had to buy a new TV for my bed room I bought a "dump" monitor and plugged a FireTV in.
I have one of the first gen smart TVs from Samsung and it's absolute cheeks now. Changing the volume, no joke, can take multiple minutes to register from the remote. When I click the volume up button, you can see the red light on the ir sensor of the TV flash, registering that it got the signal, but for it to actually change the volume, that can take multiple minutes to do. Just buy a regular tv and get an nvida shield or something similar.
Image Transcription:
Comment by user timb @[email protected] reading:
"I love my smart TV. I love the way it takes a long time to boot up because it's trying to refresh the advertisements on the home screen. I delight in the way it randomly restarts because it's downloaded an update without asking me, each of which makes the TV slower and slower with every subsequent install. I adore the way it buries the apps that I want to use, and that I use without fail every single time, below the apps that it's being paid to promote and which I have never touched in my life and would never use without the cold metal of a glock pressed hard against my sweating temple. I am infinitely thrilled by the way the interface lags constantly, due to the need to have one thousand unnecessary animations rendered on hardware ripped wholesale from a ten year old phone. I feel myself borne aloft on wings of pure joy when I am notified that my data will be collected and analysed to determine my usage patterns. Even now I am writing this from a field of beautiful flowers and soft luscious grass as I lie and look up happily at the bright blue sky, smiling happily to know that this is the future of technology."
[I am a human, if I’ve made a mistake please let me know. Please consider providing alt-text for ease of use. Thank you. 💜]
I recently bought a 75" Samsung PRO commercial tv, non smart. Plugged a firestick in, it's miles better than our TV with built in Roku that always restarts, freezes and is slow. I told the wife this tv will only be replaced when it breaks.
I bought a little antenna DVR box and it's absolutely delightful. it has the interface of a 2000s VCR, doesn't connect to the internet, doesn't have little ads and promo screens anywhere, has a simple plug and play DVR that records drm free mp4s to any USB device I plug in, and just stays on doing what it's doing, no shitty little
we noticed you haven't hit a button in 2 hours!screen. i feel like I'm in a nursing home. it's beautifulI choose to use a mini PC with arch Linux to connect to me TV. Most of media services I have can be access through the web browser.
I'm going to be in the market for a new tv in a few months.
Professionally, I have worked in the home electronics / automation industry for over 25 years. I haven't sold or installed a new TV in over five years. I am dreading the selection of a new TV. I was just thinking about this last night - I'm going to have to go to a store and have a sales person show me all the features I don't want on the TV to make a decision.
My understanding is that you can simply not connect the TV to the internet and this may prevent any issues. I strictly use an Apple TV so, if this is the case, are there any TVs that this is sure to be avoided? Are there some that prevent you from using it without a network connection?
The fact that I have to have this consideration over the purchase of a television is absolutely bonkers to me.
I just purchased a new Samsung TV. it required an Internet connection when I first set it up, but once I got through that initial data dump / update, I reset the network configuration and turned it back into a dumb(er) TV.
I use a piholed Roku 4k for my main streaming device. I will admit it is also trying its damnedest to track what I consume and serve ads to me too, but what am I going to do? Read a book?
https://labzilla.io/blog/force-dns-pihole
I've been meaning to do this for a while as I noticed that the TVs in our house are slyly avoiding PiHole for DNS
The cold steel of a glock barrel against my temple applies to the whole "Smart" part of my TVs. Everything has a Kodi rPi attached to an HDMI input.
LibreELEC is the solution
Modern day poetry
Someone should start a brand like Nothing Phone / other niche phone manufacturers, but for TVs. Many of us have an attachment to iOS that makes the phone space really difficult, but I'd jump on a beefed up nerdy niche smart TV in a heartbeat.
I love my Shield. Except that the remote is a ridiculous shape, it is a fantastic way to stream to a TV.
I just spent an hour trying to figure out why my smart tv is not routing audio to my external speakers, why there's an audio lag on ALL videos and apps, why the fire cube tv is non-responsive, when all I had to do was unplug and plug the TV back in.
Modern TVs are great, but please just make this a more polished product FFS
KDE-bigscreen shall be our savoiur
I have my TV offline, connected to my Xbox, with HDMI-CEC enabled.
When I turn on the Xbox, it automatically turns the TV on, which goes to my last used input (the Xbox). From there I can launch whatever streaming apps I want.
I know I have to deal with Microsoft's nonsense too, but at least the performance is good and it shows the most recent app at the top of my home page.
I love my pihole...
I never experience any of this..
Buy a sceptre 4K screen .. no smart features at all. Hook up whatever device you want, computer, Roku, Apple TV, pi running Kodi ..
Mmmm, I love that my tv's remote constantly listens to my conversations and sends recordings back to the maker all under the guise of "improving voice control".
I have a smart TV.
It's hooked up to my computer, remote operated with the Unified Remote app.
Now that I think about it, advertisers go against themselves when they both push useless shit and collect usage data.
Like, if I keep accidentally clicking on an ad app, and the telemetry shows that I keep clicking on it, then the conclusion might be that I love that particular app?
Well, and the separate app telemetry shows that it always runs for 3 seconds before being closed, so the conclusion is that it needs to be pushed and advertised more?
I've only had stuttering issues with my 7 y/o Samsung. The $150 Roku TV I bought a year ago has no issues.
Guys, I think this is missing a "/s" . Not sure though...
I bought a signage TV to avoid all the smart TV garbage. Mostly I hated that they take so long to hit and are laggy af. Mine boots up quick (no OS) and does not lag because it is hooked up to a Chromecast. My only complaint is that there are only two inputs.
When you click translate, here's what it says:
h a l p
get and root an android tv box, if you want a cheap one, get a xiaomi mi box, don't get cheap-ass chinese crap (like the X... ones) from AliExpress.
Screw TVs, digital signage is the way. With every new smart TV I am more convinced that I'm just going to buy this display from this Jeff Geerling video
Amen, brotha.
Ahh, capitalism. Serving up the greatest innovations of our time! ... Innovations protecting capital...
I seriously don't know how morons think it's the source of the good parts when the internet was invented by and is managed by the principles of Communism. Government-made but NOT charged for, managed largely by the engineers who have the talent and knowhow (all of the bodies working on specifications like HTTP, TLS, HTML, JavaScript, etc)...
If all of the tech worked off of the principles of Capitalism, every single person who's contributed would want to charge for their work and the licensimg just to launch a static website would require a fcking army of beurocrats to sort.
Then there'd be "innovation" from accounting firms to make it a one-stop "solution" to the problem by charging everyone to deal with it. Then the lobbyists would petition Congress to make you HAVE to use those services, and suddenly, the politicians think they've solved the problem when all they've done is institutionalize the cost.
and that's the power of Capitalism mixed in with the government!
I would honestly love to try switching to an alternative than continue using Fire OS on my Insignia TV, but I don't know of any good alternatives. Maybe I just haven't dug deep enough, but most "3rd party" (not Amazon or Google) Android implementations seem to only support phones, not TVs.
Fortunately, Fire TV can still install apps from outside their app store (like SmartTubeNext), but that can only do so much.
What kind of shitty brand are people buying that have this issue?
None of what he's complaining about has ever happened to me. And the few things that are real, are options that you can disable in two seconds.
It reminds me of when someone posted an article about how Sony has an "ad bar" at the bottom of the screen...
To get the screenshot the author had pressed the input button so that all the installed apps showed up on the bottom, and they acted like it was always there and couldn't be removed
