So wholsum 🙏🙏🙏

Anthropomorphism.

That's a mouth full.

Sometimes it seems we are too evolved for our own good but I like to think this tendency of ours will lead to a greater good.

That theory goes out the window when you have a city sliker meet a farm animal in person. One of my favorite childhood pass times was seeing city blokes cower in fear of petting a chicken or goat especially when that same person has pictures of chickens in their home because they are cute

My grandmother raised chickens and there was rooster that used to harass my mother and her siblings and they hated the rooster. Apparently one day the rooster pecked at my grandmother's leg and then they had rooster stew for dinner. Point of the story is that roosters are assholes.

Coq au vin is worth it for the time and labour to prepare it.

What people need to realize, especially those in peta, is that we cannot compare the suffering and mass killing animals to the same happening to humans. Speaking to someone who loves animals, they are a completely different life form that do not have human morals, values, intelligence, or emotion.

Which isn't to say that they don't have their own intelligence or emotion, it's just very different from what the human thought process is like.

Thus it would be absurd to put them on the same pedestal as homosapiens, evolutionarily speaking.

Life is not a Disney cartoon, that I understand that I will be down voted by vegans who don't understand this and will call me cruel.

That said I obviously support the Humane treatment of animals, but if you think I'm going to stop eating a creature that would eat me with far less hesitation if the roles were reversed, you are truly a fool.

I didn't witness it but there are a few chicken farms around the area - the kind where chickens can freely roam around a huge shed - and I was told from an acquaintace that works at one they had been on the lookout for foxes, as they had already destroyed a few coops around the farm.

One morning they arrive at the barn to find a few dead chickens and two foxes partially skeletonized on the floor. It was a gruesome sight and the recording from the security cameras showed the foxes had been completely overrun by a mob of angry chickens that pecked, kicked and essentially killed by the thousand cuts method the poor wannabe predators.

The few chickens the foxes managed to kill were not enough to deter the mob but instead served to further spur it into a killer frenzy.

Because foxes are a protectes species, they had to call the authorities to give notice and have the cadavers picked up. Even the municipal vet was horrified at the state the chickens had left the foxes.

Here is an alternative Piped link(s):

here's a video of a single hen killing a hawk

Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.

I own chickens and have had a bullying problem in the past. In the winter they have a lot less space and they get bored and stressed easily. The hen that took the "rooster"/protector role started pecking the smallest and sweetest chicken and drew blood. I had to keep the small chicken isolated from the flock for a few weeks while its wounds healed and put special goggles on the bully chicken for a month- they prevent it from seeing in front of itself so it forgets what's there after a few seconds. Yeah they can be vicious, but it's definitely preventable if they're raised right instead of at a factory farm.

Won't pigs gladly eat a whole person

I once read about a turkey that had to be wraped in a tea towel to allow a wound to heal as the creature kept pecking at it and ripping out pieces of flesh that would glady eat.

That is pretty high on the extreme behavior list. And I think it was a pet turkey.

Jesus

I could keep these little dinosaurs as pets, with no other objective or purpose besides admiring them because they are pretty to look at and that would not prevent any of the behaviors I listed.

What I'm about to say may evade you but cruelty is not an exclusive trait to human beings and chicken are a good example of it. They can be extremely cruel towards their own kind just for the sake of it. Not out of scarcity of food or living space. Just because they want to make another animal miserable.

Hate animal fights. The only animal fights I'll condone involve two homo sapiens trying to pour each others brains through their hear onto the ground, by means of punches and/or kicks to the head, at the sound of a bell.

I had about a dozen chickens in an outdoors coop, with plenty of space (about 32 cubic metres of tridimensional space) and often carried them around in a chicken tractor (birds of prey area where I live) for grazing and some individuals exihibited extreme behaviors.

Again, variations will occur from breed to breed and from individual to individual.

Some breeds are especially known for being tamer than others and more concerned with eggs and brood than others.

I'll partially agree on your statement that all roosters are assholes: we had one that enjoyed crowing when we were trying to talk anywhere in the bird's line of sight.

Chickens are basically tiny raptors. They even hunt mice when given the chance

That's why I'm a cannibal

It’s feather licking good

Here is an alternative Piped link(s):

https://piped.video/QSuu0acj1LQ?si=SWLhJGgbstDkl8yn

https://piped.video/x-Xkou8TCxA?si=BqEomgnqWXcFYb82

https://piped.video/b37qU7lI8Xc?si=-s-HzVjMRGJMyp7T

https://piped.video/hGuSyhg2HCk?si=GT99KgGvKp4ei4NW

https://piped.video/vk6WQp70IQ0?si=uRbW7oYQ-pG2Us1

Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.

Thank you! There's surprisingly an awful number of supporters here, I don't know why...

[email protected] @smirk:sh.itjustworks however you use mentions

"just case the textbook anti-PETA rhetoric comes into the thread…

This is why people hate PETA.

Yes, PETA does some crazy shit, but as with many things there are two sides to the story which is difficult to see when you get bombarded by anti-PETA stuff as is common on e.g. Reddit.

Anti-PETA efforts by the meat industry:

Sites like www.petakillsanimals.com are run by the Center for Organizational Research and Education, which is a lobbying platform for the fast food, meat, alcohol and tobacco industries. They also target the humane society, even John Oliver did a piece on them and their founder Richard Berman. That’s just one outlet for their misinformation-campains, they are also cited in lots of blogs and “news articles” as well, so it’s not always very obvious.

nathan-winograd-in-perspective

nathan-winograd-misinformation-machine

They are the driving power behind all the misinformation and PETA-hate that is spread around. PETA is actually doing a lot for animal rights, that’s why they are such a big target for smear campaigns:

[Their biggest victories] (https://www.peta.org/about-peta/milestones/)

[All victories sorted by recent] (https://www.peta.org/about-peta/victories/) (several per week!)

See also http://www.petakillsanimalsscam.com/

PETA and their kill-shelters:

PETA kills animals because unfortunately there are no better places for them. Blame the puppy mills and irresponsible short term owners that give up their pets a few days or weeks after getting them because they had no idea what they got themselves into. Those people create more pets than there are places for them, so instead of having them become strays and further add to the problem, PETA put down those they can’t adopt out. Because PETA accepts all animals, even those that other shelters turn away in order to not sully their adoption numbers, PETA shelters end up with many more “hopeless” animals. See more here.

The case of the mistaken dog (and how PETA doesn’t steal and murder pets):

A farmer asked PETA to euthanise a pack of stray dogs that were aggressive and violent towards the farmer’s cows. Upon arrival, PETA found the pack of stray dogs, took them to the shelter and put them down, as a free service. Unfortunately it turned out, that one of the presumed stray dogs was a pet-chihuaha called Maya, that was not sitting on the porch, as often claimed, but running freely with the stray pack, without leash or collar or supervision. PETA fucked up, because they didn’t wait the 5 day grace period to give the owners time to look for and collect their pet. That’s why they had to pay a fine and apologized for it. http://www.whypetaeuthanizes.com/maya.html

The monkey selfie:

The monkey took the picture himself btw, the photographer just left the camera lying around. I am not saying the monkey should be copyright holder and it’s an open-shut case, but it does raise the question about the photographer having ownership over something that was voluntarily and independently created by an animal. What if a painter would leave his brushes lying around and an animal would create a painting? The artist actually sees it the same way and settled for a compromise with PETA followed by a joint statement. This was a landmark case in copyright law.

PETA equating milk to racism:

White supremacists actually use milk to demonstrate their superiority over “inferior” (their words, obviously) lactose intolerant ethnicities. That’s the reason behind their campaign on the issue.

Final thoughts (I promise):

PETA does a good job at raising issues and are one of the most successfull organisations to fight for animal rights. The granting of rights is the only real way to protect animals from unneccessary cruelty. Animal welfare will always be arbitrary, both in what species are worthy of protection, and the extent of protection they are worthy of. You cannot consider yourself an animal lover without recognizing the importance of that.

Sometimes PETA (intentionally?) overshoot, that happens when you try to move the border of current perceptions (i.e. animals are objects to be used for food, clothes, entertainment). I am not here to defend their tone or (lack of) tact, and there are a number of (sometimes downright stupid) PETA-campaigns I disagree with. I’m not trying to convice you to become their friend, but at least judge them for what they are doing, not for what they are said to do.

Most of the criticism of PETA you read on Reddit comes straight from the mouths of the Center for Organizational Research and Education (CORE), formerly known as the Center for Consumer Freedom (CCF). It’s basically a corporate propaganda organization with donors like Tyson Foods, Wendy’s, and Coca-Cola. They also run campaigns claiming obesity isn’t that major of a problem and that you can eat 10 times as much mercury from fish as experts recommend. The vast majority of the animals PETA euthanizes are suffering and are brought to PETA’s shelter by their owners specifically to be put out of their misery, but the CCF distorts that into “PETA is stealing people’s pets off the streets” and Reddit gobbles it up.

The media also knows that PETA is an easy target. Years ago I read an article in one of the British tabloids (the Sun or the Mirror) with a headline something like, “PETA blasts child’s bunny wedding!” But if you actually read the article, what happened is a kid dressed up some bunnies in wedding outfits, the “journalist” reached out to PETA and asked them to comment, and PETA said something like, “we don’t support dressing rabbits in costumes because it may be stressful for them.” And that was the end of the story, but that wouldn’t get clicks so they distorted the headline to make it sound like PETA was protesting or attacking the kid on their own accord.

For the record, I think there are perfectly legitimate criticisms of PETA, like the sexist imagery they use in some of their ad campaigns and their welfarist (as opposed to abolitionist) approach to advocacy. It just gets to me that so many redditors claim to be rational and free-thinking but then read literal corporate propaganda about PETA and swallow it whole without a second thought.

Info continued here if anyone is interested… https://sh.itjust.works/comment/2252698

Then… https://sh.itjust.works/comment/2252784

Then… https://sh.itjust.works/comment/2252805"

Do more research on that claim.

I'm a full-time meat eater, but I respect vegans who don't go around minding people's businesses, which is exactly what peta does.

Based

See my message above in response to flying squid. Same message response.

Or maybe the dude from The Hunger Games? You know, the weird one with the bad name?

That too, but not as much as PeTA

I have never seen a vegan preach, here or on reddit. But i have seen hundreds of comments complaining about preachy vegans.

Would you also consider it preachy when people criticize other cases of animal harm, like bullfighting or dog beating, or is it just the financing of factory farming that can't be criticized? If not, what's the difference? It's troublesome that people enforce a social stigma that you can't talk about what we do to farm animals without suffering social consequences.

And unfortunately the preachy ones are the only ones ever speaking up

Yeah, it's the ones who talk about their thoughts that are the issue. Fucking jerks!

There's definitely been a shift. I didn't see these kinds of mindless "pop" posts until very recently.

Don't worry, he's heard it before because he goes out of his way looking for it :)

I know