Trump asks judge to gut classified documents case after immunity ruling
Trump asks judge to gut classified documents case after immunity ruling
Filing asks Aileen Cannon to take scalpel to any charges considered ‘official’ acts that could not be prosecuted
That a literal case of stealing state secrets and refusing to return them could possibly be shielded by this ruling demonstrates just how insane it is.
a literal case of stealing state secrets and refusing to return them
I can't imagine how anyone could make a serious argument that is an "official act".
I know they'll try, but it's cartoon villain levels of ridiculous.
The layers of protection provided in the Supreme Court ruling makes it very easy to justify either immunity or simply excluding all evidence of a non-official crime. It's much broader than just "official vs. non-official". The LegalEagle YouTube channel has a good run through of all the ways in which immunity or effective immunity could be achieved and it's bad. "Top 5 worst Supreme Court rulings ever."
It may not matter at all. Imagine it's deemed unofficial and he wins the election, he will almost definitely pardon himself. Pardon powers were never given reasonable limits.
People have undervalued that the real check on a president's powers is in the hands of the voters. The next strongest checks seem to be the lifespan of the executive and the two term limit.
Here’s how it’s gonna work:
- Claim immunity in this case? “Well why? You weren’t the president”
- Claim that the 2020 election was “stolen” and that he rightfully was President when 1 occured
- Claim 1/6 was “official” too due to a stolen election
Because, sadly, some of those others are still in limbo, Canon will be more than happy to put things on hold “while preceding matters are sorted out”
Because the ruling quite literally says that anything the president does as the president is presumed to have immunity unless the prosecution can argue that applying criminal law couldn't possibly impact on the core work of the office of the president, and that their motivation for doing what they do can't be considered when making that determination.
"As the president" Trump asked the justice department to falsely claim it had discovered election fraud as part of a plot to steal the election.
The supreme Court ruled that this is protected because if you ignore his motivation, punishing the president for consulting with the justice department about election fraud would clearly impede the core functions of the office.Without considering motivation, would punishing the president for transporting documents he has legal access to to a place he's allowed to take them impact impact the function of the office?
It's a very bad ruling.
He was no longer president. How is this an official act?
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He may try to argue he took them while he was president, and therefore, no charges can be filed. Actions and motives while the president can not be looked at either.
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In the immunity ruling, "Just Us" CT added a note he thought Jack Smiths appointment was illegitimate. This means that if she tosses the entire case, it will inevitably get to the SCOTUS where there is at least 1 friendly judge that would let him off. Judging by the 6-3 ruling, I wouldn't be surprised if there were actually 6 judges.
I am sure Jack Smith can argue all the other crimes of keeping, obstructing, and distributing the documents to those with out security clerence is still a crime but it's if the question of his legitimacy if the reason. I think the SCTUS will agree with Cannon over the actual law for some BS reasons the founding fathers are believed to have said along time ago.
For what it's worth, it's really hard to read this post (which you seem to have put some actual effort into) because you're writing it with odd abbreviations and slang. I know you're trying to be edgy or something but when you have something worthwhile to say, it's best to communicate it in a way that the majority of people who run across it can understand, rather than wrap it in what effectively amounts to lingo and jargon.
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It would force them to drop evidence about his state of mind when he took the documents. They would essentially be unable to argue anything at all about how they ended up there. The case would then ONLY be about him not returning them later on request, with no other context available for the ruling
Don't they have proof of him having them moved after the fact to try and hide he had them?
Why doesn't Biden just have Trump and the conservative SC judges shot for treason? It'd be an "official act" and therefore OK according to conservatives, after all. It'd make the world in general a better place, and also help stop the US sliding (further…) into fascism
I'm getting tired of hearing these "Why doesn't Biden just be a despot to stop another despot?" knee-jerk takes. Even as a joke, it's not helping. Once you stoop to your enemy's level, is there a difference anymore? Think about the kind of precedent that sets. As a country, can you even come back from that? We'd be trading one very dark path for another.
We have a system of checks and balances that can be used, assuming we elect people who aren't part of the problem.
People need to get the fuck out and vote. Every election, every office, school board seat, dogcatcher, etc. Got friends who don't vote? Try to get at least one of them to. Yeah, gerrymandering exists but it doesn't hold a candle to voter apathy when it comes to damage done.
Glad to know I'm getting downvoted because I don't support becoming the very thing we're supposedly fighting against.
Unilaterally taking away your own options doesn't help either. You can be damn sure Trump, and Republicans in general, will do whatever they think they can get away with. Remember when a year before the election was too early to nominate a supreme court Justice, but later it was totally cool to jam one through during the election.
Trump is openly saying he will do that. This won't be fixed without amending the Constitution or SCOTUS receiving that decision.
Here's the problem: we're watching the country errode in incredible time, the far right has sunk it's claws into the government and it seemingly has no way to actually prevent it's damage. All of the checks and balances seem to mean nothing as actual laws that people relied on are being repealed every month. And this might not be the worst of it, if Trump gets elected with a Senate majority, everything will probably flip seemingly overnight.
All we can do is vote and call representatives to tell them to support us. You could probably protest too but be careful out there. If you're someone that might be targeted by an auth right regime, you might want to get your passport ready.
Thank you.
I'm happy to find a rare voice of reason
The court's ruling prevents the president from being personally charged criminally for official acts during the presidency. The ruling doesn't give the executive branch unlimited powers. The ruling doesn't put the executive branch above the authority of the courts. The ruling doesn't force federal employees to blindly follow any order given by the president. Courts and congress can stop the executive branch. The checks and balances still exist.
The president can't be charged for any crimes they commit when on duty, just like cops and CEOs. They charge the organization with the crime to shield the individual who actually did the crime. This is american justice. Turns out many people are above the law.
The threat of eventual prosecution is not the only thing preventing widespread political assassinations.
Immunity and authority are two different things. There is no reason to believe an unlawful order would be obeyed under Biden.
One of the core functions of the presidency is to sell secrets and advance foreign technology such that they may hurt our country economically in the future. Yeah, let's absolve Trump of this too. And if we could also bring three or 4 virgins for him to rape comfortably during the preceding that would be great 👍.
Your honor, could you please bring Trump to the podium? Oh it's ok, that's how he does it. He usually doesn't grab too hard so no worries, your pussy will be just fine.