Remember kids, keep your cats indoors. Unless you live on a farm, outdoor cats are either dead cats, or pests.
Oh I got into a "discussion" with my neighbour who's friend said she was cruel for having indoor cats.
I said her friend is thick and should be ignored, because she is and she should be.
Well the neighbour decided instead to give her cats to the Shelter and now has indoor dogs.
I don't like my neighbour, she's stupid with stupid friends, and cruel to animals.
In other news, one of my indoor cats is 19 years old.
My cat just sits in my backyard all day
That's good, in that sense your yard is essentially acting as an enclosure. Unfortunately most cats don't only stay in the back yard, and in those cases the owner should either cat-proof their yard to keep the cat inside it, or keep their cat inside their home unless walking them on a leash.
Eh even on farms they're not the most effective
Sure cats sometimes catch mice, but you know what else also catches mice and is actually native to wherever your area is? Owls.. Owls that are being chased off by said cat.
Let your local raptors do their job people.
I think it depends on where you live. Where I live there's not as many owls because everything is just grassland/prairie, so lots of farms still have farm cats for pest control, but I do think it's ideal to go without if you can.
If you're in an environment where cats are not natural and are invasive, don't buy cats. Keeping them indoors isn't a solution. It's cruel for the cat unless you have an environment specifically set up to house them. All these problems come from people having cats in places they aren't native and shouldn't be to begin with.
Yeah, okay. So much less cruel to just trap and kill them all. Unless you've got a secret cat utopia where they can all go to.
The problem is there already. People adopting and keeping them indoors is not the problem.
A real solution would be better laws and enforcement involving cat breeders and people who let cats roam and reproduce freely. Or all the assholes around the time COVID lockdowns who figured they could just adopt temporarily and then abandon their pets.
Most domestic cats do just fine indoors.
House cat sized cats aren't natural to anywhere are they? I thought they were bred smaller over many many years.
If you're in an environment where cats are not natural and are invasive
There's no such thing. Cats are a domesticated species, they aren't native to anywhere. Their ancestors were possibly native to the fertile crescent in Syria and to ancient Egypt (among a handful of other places they're believed to possibly have originated from, it's hard to pin down), but even if only people in those places ever owned cats, if they let them outdoors all the time it would still be bad for the environment and cause issues. So instead of expecting something completely unreasonable, like the rest of the world no longer keeping cats as pets, let's stuck with something reasonable, like not letting cats roam freely outdoors.
Keeping cats indoors isn't any more cruel than keeping dogs indoors. You can leash train a cat, or let them out in a cat-proofed back yard, just like we can with dogs. Cat territory size is dependent on availability of resources, they don't have an innate need to wander large distances as a species. Some individuals might have some wander lust sure, but that's what leash training is for. Take them on hikes, you don't have to put them outside unsupervised with the racoons and coyotes and cars and vulnerable bird species.
Outdoor cats have half the lifespan of indoor cats for a reason. The dead cats I regularly see on the side of the highway on my way home from work certainly aren't happier than my neighbour's cat is walking around on a leash alive and healthy. If you learn how to provide proper exercise and enrichment for your cat either indoors or under supervision/on a leash then you don't need to let them outside unsupervised. If you want your cat to be both happy and safe, then there are plenty of options that are better for both your cat and the local ecosystem. This is something we naturally expect of dog owners, there's no reason why we can't do the same with cats.
I'm in the 'Twitter posts aren't memes' side on this. Not even feeling slightly baited by the rage.
We'd welcome anything like this at [email protected].
/c/[email protected] - opens in your local instance
[email protected] - opens in it's home instance
I mean, this became a pretty prominent template so I don't know how much you can really say it's not a meme, unless you don't regard words in general as capable of being memes.
This was my family when I was a kid. We never had a cat for more than 2-5 years because there were coyotes and pumas out there. Except for one cat who lived to old age. I think we had a dozen cats during my childhood. I remember thinking they were happier with their freedom, even though it meant their lives were short.
I know better now. I still think cats are happier when they can go outside, but it's not worth the risk to their lives and also the lives of the local smaller wildlife.We let our cats in the garden supervised if they want but they're indoor cats otherwise. One will go out for a short time and come back in if we go in, and the other one has absolutely no interest in going out and would rather cosey up on my pillow.
They're both elderly but have been that way since they were kittens/rescued.
We got them harnesses so we could take them out and see stuff but they weren't all that into it.
We have puzzle games and plenty of toys for them. The oldest loves a puzzle and can out maneuver our dog at them, but the younger one has a single braincell and is as dumb as a box of rocks. She's happy just to sit to your lap and get pets.
I remember thinking they were happier with their freedom, even though it meant their lives were short.
I know better now.You can be trapped in the most luxurious palace, with your every want attended to, but you cannot leave.
Or, you can be free to go where you please, still have your wants attended to, but there is a chance you will die young and the last hour of your life will be spent in terror and excruciating pain.
Which do you choose?
Honestly a bit of a tough question. I'm not sure, myself.
Interesting concept but cats don't have the sapience to understand the risk involved with being outside. You could say the same thing about children, but because adults know better we don't let them do whatever they please.
I think the risk can be weighed and mitigated. Coyotes mainly come out at night, and you can keep a cat indoors at night. If every new cat gets promptly snapped up anyway, maybe it's just not a safe enough area.
Honest question, how do you keep a cat indoors at night? We used to call them, but sometimes they wouldn't show up. That meant you might see them the next day, or never again. One little poofy grey cat we had disappeared for a week before turning up soaking wet and meowing frantically. Cats are quick and can make pretty good distance from your house, so when you're calling them in for the night, they could be literally anywhere. They also like to hunt at sunset, so might just ignore you on purpose.
That's my experience anyways. I think some of the other comments here are right, that a limited outdoor space that they could enjoy but not escape from would be ideal. I don't have a yard so my cats are indoor only. I did try to leash-train the smarter one but she was not having it.
edit: we would clang their food dishes and shake the food bags. Calling them in for the night was also feeding time. My experience was that despite this they wouldn't show up sometimes.
It breaks my heart with how many irresponsible pet owners there are. There's no good reason to let your cat outside. People who can't accept that shouldn't have cats.
Mine started life as an indoor cat, but after we put in a dog door for the pups there was no chance. She figured it out by watching them and lets herself out for the occasional prowl (around 4-6 hours a day, she usually goes no farther than the neighbors yard). She doesn't stay out overnight though, she'd rather sleep inside with her dog.
Honestly that's really shitty dude. You should figure out how to keep the cat indoors
They make dog doors that only open if the animal has a fob on their collar. Would let the dogs out but keep the cat in.
Just make the coyote to be your pet at this point
I just lost my very beloved barn cat to a suspected coyote attack.
It really sucks. He was a feral cat not deemed suitable for a home and he went from hissing at me for weeks to a total cuddly love...with a wild wall climbing streak.
He knew love, friendship, a warm bed and a full belly but the guilt I have is all consuming. He lived a great life but man...my barn feels very sad and quiet these days.
It really sounds like you gave him a great life that nobody else would have. Without you they would have died a feral cat only knowing struggle within the unending fight for food and warmth. With you they got to know love and got to leave all that struggle behind. You did good.
What happened to using punctuation?
Sells the joke better. If you split the sentence into clauses, using commas, then you give the brain a little rest and it would get to the punchline before you read it.
Reads like the chaotic stream of consciousness of a four year old
Who cares if its legible? Why not message who ever wrote it originally and ask them?
Outdoor cats should be illegal
How bad it is depends on where you live, but yeah, for a lot of reasons most of the world probably shouldn't have outdoor housecats. As the article you linked pointed out though, most of the damage is being done by feral cats, and well... that cat's out of the bag, so to speak.
The number of birds killed by cats per year matches ironically the number of animals us humans kill per day for food if we include marine animals. 😄
Yep, I can't believe the hypocrisy either, pretty much all major cities require that dogs be on a leash or in a yard. Cats though? Can't have them on a leash! Are you crazy!?! 😱
Are we really getting the indoor cat brigade on lemmy too? Yes, in the US outdoor cats are a danger to local wildlife. Stop pushing this on people who this does not apply to. Outdoor cats are fine in many other parts of the world. The USA isn't the whole world.
Suggesting or thinking that this issue only applies to cats in USA / North America is uninformed at best.
Australia has ~650 million lizards killed each year by feral and outdoor cats, ~225/cat
As of 2013, Canada has 100-350 million birds killed by cats each year
As of 2021, China estimates based on public survey's that "1.61–4.95 billion invertebrates, 1.61–3.58 billion fishes, 1.13–3.82 billion amphibians, 1.48–4.31 billion reptiles, 2.69–5.52 billion birds, and 3.61–9.80 billion mammals" there each year"
Cats and other vermin are absolutely destroying native populations in New Zealand as all of the birds there evolved with essentially no native predators.
South Africa, Cape Town alone estimates that 300k cats kill 27.5m critters each year
This is not unique to the states. Keep your cats inside.
let's arrest cats living as cats!
Or, or, or -- instead of doing that fucking absurd thing you suggested to try to ignore the valid points other people are making, we deal with them the same way we deal with other ecologically disastrous invasive species.
coyotes gotta eat too...
We've got two blind cats. They're indoor, but we take them in the yard and let them do their thing under supervision. Trying to catch bugs will usually just end up in a bee sting, and catching small game is largely out of the question. Tho they have chased deer away.
The coyotes around me are massive. I thought I was seeing things one night as a big ass German Shepard sized dog walked cross my yard.
