The mother of tattoo artist Shani Louk who was paraded semi-naked on a Hamas truck makes a public plea for more information
The mother of tattoo artist Shani Louk who was paraded semi-naked on a Hamas truck makes a public plea for more information
The body of the German-Israeli tattoo artist Shani Louk, clad only in her underwear, was paraded through the streets of Gaza by Hamas.
The mother of a woman whose body was paraded through the streets by Hamas has pleaded for help finding her daughter.
A video showing German tattoo artist Shani Louk on the back of a pickup truck circulated on social media after the Palestinian militant group Hamas attacked Israel on October 7.
Louk had been attending an outdoor "Festival for Peace" party near Kibbutz Urim when the area was targeted. First, rockets were launched, then gunmen and appeared and shot into the crowd, CNN reported. Party attendees told the outlet people immediately started to flee, passing dead bodies on the ground as they tried to escape the massacre.
The attack and resulting conflict has left hundreds of Israelis and Palestinians dead, with Israel's prime minister declaring war.
A video of a young woman with dreadlocks on the back of a pickup truck and surrounded by Hamas soldiers started circulating on social media shortly after the attack. In it, she appears stripped to her underwear, and her legs are bent at unnatural angles, while one soldier grabs her hair. People are also seen spitting on her body.
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In it, she appears stripped to her underwear, and her legs are bent at unnatural angles, while one soldier grabs her hair. People are also seen spitting on her body.
And some terrorist supporters here on Lemmy were trying to explain to us that they were just casually "transporting" the body of a dead woman and that they weren't doing anything disgusting with her. We all know what islamist terrorists do when they spot a young woman, to pretend that Hamas is any different from ISIS is to be completely delusional.
Palestinians will lose more and more support (mine already) as long as they keep shielding the Islamist animals of Hamas.
EDIT: also thank goodness for [email protected], because others like [email protected] are run by terrorist supporters (see for yourself in their modlog: https://lemmy.ml/modlog/14788)
So question, can you be anti terrorist and anti Israel?
Why not? Hell Iām Jewish and I think the Israeli govt is regularly in the wrong and I feel for the people of Israel that could have better lives and those the govt harms. I also think Hamas is evidently wretched and those perpetrating these abhorrent acts deserve everything coming to them.
Unfortunately, while Iām sure Hamas will suffer, the civilians of both Israel and Palestine will once again bear the true cost of this conflict.
What's your opinion on Palestinians?
My opinion is that they are a people, caged. The conditions that they live in are far below what they deserve for being human.
Thatās my opinion really: theyāre humans, just like all others and they deserve to be treated with dignity and to be loved and to be able to sleep knowing that they are safe. They have been deprived of these things for far, far too long and I believe that is deeply wrong.
Whatās your opinion on Palestinians?
I strongly disagree with Israel's policies regarding settlements, Palestinians in general, etc.
That does not excuse Hamas or their terrorism
They're both kinda fucked really.
Israel is more fucked because they definitely have the resource to prevent this. How long can you deprive someone of their basic needs before their humanity is stripped away?
That only holds until you realize that Hamas are islamic jahadists. The latter are worse, no question.
Both are crimes under various international laws, some people seem to think you fight one by committing the other
Whats the altenative? Another generation of palestinians lost to the political whims of Netenyahu and the dehumanized at the hands of the far right while calmly waiting for the world to finally stop turning a blind eye? Can they start fighting back after they've been oppressed for 100 years or do we have to wait even longer?
Maybe Palestinians could try living in Jordan? Oh, Black September and all that happened.
Or maybe Lebanon would work? Oh, that's how we got Hezbollah, who has basically taken over Lebanon.
Maybe Egypt will open their doors to the Palestinians again? But then again, Rafah border crossing is almost always closed, because Egypt's de facto relationship with the Palestinians could be described as "we like you, but mostly because we hate Israel more".
I sympathize enormously with every normal Palestinian, but Mandatory Palestine will never be a thing again. The so-called State of Israel will continue to exist. It has been too long, and the only humanitarian hope for everyone involved is for Hamas and all related groups to accept defeat. But I don't see that happening, because the conflict isn't just over historical lands and freedom, but to eradicate all Zionists.
the only humanitarian hope for everyone involved is for Hamas and all related groups to accept defeat.
so be subjugated or die? That seems barbaric, not humanitarian.
"subjugated"? Don't be inane now. What's your solution, other than Hamas ceasing their terrorist attacks?
The solution would be to end the occupation of Gaza and the West Bank, and granting all Palestinians within those territories full citizenship, voting rights, and economic reparations for the hardship they suffered at the hands of the Israeli state.
Then you wouldn't have the desperate poverty and crowded ghettos that make people desperate enough to join Hamas to begin with.
subjugated
Yes subjegated. Look up the definition. Don't be inane now.
The alternative would be a secular, progressive, democratic resistance to the occupation, it's a lot easier to win international support if you're not a bunch insane religious fundamentalists (Hamas, not the Palestinian people broadly). I agree with your sentiment 100%, I just don't think Hamas is an organization that's capable of freeing Palestine from Israeli occupation.
Especially since Netanyahu's government literally sent them money because a relatively strong Hamas makes it easier for him to justify the ongoing genocide/ethnic cleansing of Palestinians.
I donāt support either group here. But the reason this continues to be such a contentious issue is the decades of mistakes and extreme conflict that lead to the current state of things there. The entire area has been in cyclic conflict for hundreds of years, this is merely a continuation of that with the complexities of post ww2 short sighted and racist policies enacted by the allied powers influencing the way things have played out.
Israel is a far right authoritarian state and they are brutal in how they choose to operate. Palestine is a hotbed for terrorism and is equally brutal in the guerrilla tactics they employ.
External influence from western and Islamic countries fuels the flames. Itās a disaster and a mess.
Thereās genuinely no two state solution. As long as these two groups share this place they will always fight. And thereās no resolution that doesnāt see everyone else dragged into yet another proxy war.
Personally I think this will see some of the most major developments in this conflict in decades. The repercussions of this act will be large scale and relentless. But the Israelis will quickly find themselves in a quagmire if they try to occupy Palestine in any major capacity. It wonāt be over quickly. Many will die.
But I suspect thatās where we are heading.
The entire area has been in cyclic conflict for hundreds of years
There were essentially no Jews (<2%) living in the areas of Israel and Palestine before the Zionist colonization movement in the late 1800's.
You're trying to make it seem like this modern day thing is even remotely related to the past, which it isn't.
Thereās a clear distinction between the sort of age of crusades and modern post ww2 geopolitics that generated the current conflict, but to suggest that thereās not been a near continuous level of conflict in the area between Jews, Muslims, and Christians is disingenuous.
Thereās a clear distinction between the sort of age of crusades and modern post ww2 geopolitics that generated the current conflict
This is like saying the BLM movement in America has nothing to do with slavery.
but to suggest that thereās not been a near continuous level of conflict in the area between Jews, Muslims, and Christians is disingenuous.
It's not disingenuous. Jewish people literally just weren't there until very recently. You're talking like 1000+ years ago.
Itās not disingenuous. Jewish people literally just werenāt there until very recently. Youāre talking like 1000+ years ago.
This is the central question everyone can't agree on, right? Which group that conquered the region and eradicated their enemies has the "rights" to the land? I'm seriously ignorant on the subject, and more than happy to delete this comment if it's not really adding to anything, but we're calibrating our standards of who has the rights to a region based on what the latest Empire said, be it Ottomans or Romans or however far back we want to go, until we're talking literally Neolithic folks showing up, right? I'm not religious, so there's a critical part of this conflict I simply cannot fundamentally understand.
The difference between making claims based on occupation in the late 1800s versus late 800s seems arbitrary, to me. That said, I know that can sound patently ridiculous, since we're talking generations we can count on one hand versus the same number of Empires controlling the land: so this is where I throw my hands up and just cry a little. Solidarity to everyone suffering oppression and terrorism, in whatever forms they take.
Sure, you can always be hated by everybody. That's generally my MO in most things. I think Hamas is a terrorist Islamic group and the Likud are ur-fascists.
Of course
You can do anything as long as you work hard and believe in yourself
I don't think that's true :(
Not if you have a smooth brain, no
Nope unless you consider israel as the terrorists, which from the point of view of palestinians is true.
Both things can be badā¦ you know that? Right?
And sometimes one side is much worse than the other.
So which far right extremist theocracy is worse in this case?
I'd go with the one parading executed civilians and spitting on their bodies tbh.
Iād go with the one parading executed civilians and spitting on their bodies tbh.
this sadly does not narrow it down
Did you just start following this conflict yesterday? Lmao.
Mine is gone.
I never exactly condoned them, but this is the first time in my adult life they've gone out of their way to personally harm innocent civilians. It's such a shocking and brutal display that I don't know how anyone could carry water for them anymore -- at the very least, this makes them equal to the Israeli government, so someone whose horrified at the treatment of Palestinians by Israel should be just as horrified here.
It bears mentioning that in no way does Hamas represent all Palestinians, too. Hamas is hurting them too by hiding in civilian buildings and using the people effectively as shields. It's unconscionable to hide in hospitals and mosques after doing something like this, they're purposely daring Israel to make everyone around them into collateral.
It is in everyone's benefit for Hamas to be wiped out and destroyed.
Except the there are only three real ways for Israel to kill Hamas. Getting rid of every Palestinian so the are no Palestinians to get angry and turn to desperate measures. Enforcing an authoritarian state where all civil liberties are taken away from Palestinians. Or firmly rejecting expansion into areas where Palestinians live, harshly prosecuting any who discriminate against Palestinians, letting them self govern, and energizing their economy to lift standards of living drastically. An end to everything Israel does to hurt Palestinians and help themselves that Israel can do. Huge concessions to try and make up for all the shit they've done.
The ethnical option will clearly not be chosen by the current government, and the US, obligated by their desire to have allies in the middle east, will help them try to accomplish some combination of the first two options. It's awful.
where was this outrage when Israel targeted civilians?
Oh it was there, I was outraged at that as well. I believe it was Israel who accidentally killed an American journalist and refused to release evidence for some time?
There are no good guys here, by a longshot.
"Accidentally"
This is what Islamic fascism does when they think they have enough power. A Turkish leader said "Democracy is a train which you can use to reach your target."
It's possible to oppose Hamas and the Israeli government at the same time. Hamas being fundamentalist terrorists doesn't retroactively justify the Israeli government forcing millions of people into ghettos without access to clean water and regularly subjecting them to state violence. Or the ongoing settlement program, where Palestinian towns are forcibly evacuated and their property/homes stolen and given to Israeli settlers.
Two things can Both be bad at once, especially since the only reason Hamas exists is because of the desperation of Palestinians caused by Israeli state policy. Netanyahu's government even gave them money at one point, because Hamas is good for his political goals. Hamas prevents a more democratic, progressive resistance to the occupation from forming, which makes it easier for Netanyahu's government to justify their ongoing genocide/ethnic cleansing.
Ok but one of those is funny "reason:explaining antisemitism to a Jewish person"
I didn't read what they actually said but that got a solid chuckle from me
I didn't know the pope of jewdaism was a lemmee admin. What an honour.
Wasn't that what she was actually wearing? Why do people assume assaults occurred?
Colonizers versus natives, and you side with the colonizers who created this situation. Lmao.
Damn fucking straight i do the israelis are clearly in the right in this conflict the palestinians have soiled their bed and must now come too terms with it being time too lie in it.
Clapping for the fascists commiting slow genocide, bold move cotton.
And what will Germany do about one of their people being murdered in this way? Nothing. They'll hide behind their mask of progressive European nation, and do nothing, while likely supporting the bad guys, just like they do with Russia.
You can't get Germans to do anything unless you wave money in their face
What prompted this tantrum?
You must have missed the part where a young German citizen was murdered. I'm a Canadian and my government is very similar to Germany's in that they're all talk. All image, but ultimately they only care about money
What do you think germany can do in this situation?
So the Germans are supporting the bad guys, including Russia. Aha, good to know!
Besides, what would you like them to do? Less talk more invasion of Palestine?
you know, the Canadian reputation has gone on for too long, you guys seem to be neo-liberals, or Genocidal fascists
Yeah I grew up being told Canada was so great, but as I got older all I see is nothing but bullshit
seems more like you have an unhealthy media diet, considering you have decided on "genocidal fascist"
How is it genocide to kill terrorists, terrorist isn't an ethnic identity. Unless you're saying that all Palestinians are terrorists, which I never said. I can tell the difference between a Hamas militant and a Palestinian civilian even if you can't. I grew up in a war, I actually lived it, unlike your modern American/colonialist couch bound ass.
you're the one calling for some revenge killing, also I couldn't care less what war you grew up in, just as little as you don't care where I'm from and just assume me to be an "American/Colonialist", unless you have any interesting opinions on Eastern Europe you want to share as well? maybe some being upset about the US stopping the dual genocides in the Balkans?
ya, we did the whole blood and soil bit in the 1930-1945, we have since decided that ethnic cleansing is not the answer to someone getting killed.
or what would you say Germany do? go and start slaughtering the people in Gaza? maybe dig out the old playbooks, what was it 10
jewsMuslims for every German killed? is that what you are calling for?I guess your answer is to do nothing. Kill Germans? It's ok, we would hate to be seen as intolerant to terrorists, so just kill our citizens. But in truth, Germans would glass the entire continent if it meant they get more money
If someone is murdered, do we hold the entire society accountable or just the one person who committed the crime?
there are two options for what Germany could do, Nothing, or invade all of Israel, institute an occupational goverment and then rebuild the Israeli government with both Jews and Palestinians.
on the other hand, your "do something" seems to be entirely kill everyone in Gaza as revenge against Hamas.
Israel has German submarines (the German version, not the worse export version) that were gifted to them, especially suited to be used in the Persian Gulf, on the coast of Iran, where Hamas' money and equipment come from.
What do you want them to do huh?
Damn krauts.