Bad faith actors putting on a performance about their hate for new Trek (or anything progressive)

When disco fucked off to the future I started enjoying it more because it felt like it no longer didnt fit in with the timeline. And then it got to the cause of the big explosion thing and decided I hated it again for such a stupid cause.

Zero interest in Picard, feels too edgy grimdark.

LD/SNW by comparison have been enjoyable since day one.

The first two Picard seasons are… weird.

Picard S3, while not perfect, is a hell of a lot of fun, and very obviously a love note to ST fans who grew up with the 90s series.

Agreed that the cause of the Burn was just… wat. Similar levels of “wat” for that seed ship interlude where the barzan father “phased partially out of reality due to grief”.. like, come on, what in the Kentucky Fried Fuck is that bullshit?

I do think disco is mostly good, but it’s also about 5-10% catastrophically bad/nonsensical/poorly written, which can really take the wind out of your sails when watching parts of it. I must add, however, that I think the very prominent focus on mental health and trauma, as well as non-heterosexual/-heteronormative relationships was an excellent change that that series specifically introduced.
- I do think disco is mostly good, but it’s also about 5-10% catastrophically bad/nonsensical/poorly written, which can really take the wind out of your sails when watching parts of it.
  
  I like Disco, although I do think it has writing problems. But 5-10% would be a high mark for a Star Trek series.
  
  Think of all the utterly shit episodes there were of TNG despite TNG generally being considered the show the other shows want to emulate in one way or another.
  
  There’s bad episodes, and then there’s “this character was exposed to a spicy rock while in vitro and throughout childhood and then got upset one time and made all the spicy rocks explode and killed all the federation people”.
  
  Trek’s variable episode quality is a well-established trope at this point, but disco has absolutely pushed the handwavey bullshit ceiling to new heights. Disco absolutely has some really good high points, but I wish the low points weren't quite so low.
  
  This is compounded by the fact that Disco’s format is much more of an “epic season-long tale” (compared to SNW’s much more episodic format), and the fact that the writers basically bunted on the singular climactic moment of the 3rd series when it should have been a grand slam is just embarrassing and disappointing.
  
  I don't see that as any more ridiculous than 'if you go faster than infinite speed, which is somehow possible, you turn into a salamander' or 'Deanna gets energy-raped, gets pregnant, has a baby, it grows up in about 3 days into a kindergartener, then dies in her arms, but that's all okay because an alien wanted to know what being human was like' or 'this is a planet that is exactly like Earth in every way except the Roman Empire exists with 20th century technology and that makes sense because we have a theory about it.'
  
  I can keep going...
  
  Oh, don’t get me wrong - all of the instances you cited (as well as a few others) were… not good at all, and completely asinine.
  
  The primary contrast I’m drawing here is that those were bad episodes… whereas the Burn was a season-long mystery that was tied up in a neat little bow with absolute nonsensical bullshit, which frankly cheapened the impact of the season overall, and makes me roll my eyes whenever they do a callback to something Burn-related in S4. If it was confined to a single episode (like the barzan seed ship stuff I mentioned earlier), it’d be far more excusable, but in my eyes, they kinda soured the entire season by just phoning it in for what should have been one of the most important segments of the season to really nail the writing on.
  
  All that said: it’s overall still fun; I am rewatching it right now, in preparation for S5 starting to roll in April.
  
  True, but Star Trek was mostly episodic, even when there were story arcs, before Discovery too. I think the problem is more about TV shows, especially sci-fi shows, leaning very hard on the season-long mystery plot arc. Because then you're putting all your money down on a single story and if that story isn't one of the more popular ones, you take a much bigger risk.
  
  Yeah, I agree with that. Making your series into some sort of make-or-break mega-movie-ish thing can work sometimes… but it’s not the appropriate way to tell every single story, and producers seem to finally be starting to realize that. Personally, I blame the MCU and the related series for that being a screenplay writing fad for so long.
  
  Fwiw, I do think SNW has largely nailed the format for the modern era - mostly episodic, but there’s a higher-level background plot that gets touched on every once in a while, and here and there you’ll find an episode purely focused on that overarching plot. And I also think my enjoyment of DS9 and Voyager back in the day stems from that broadly-comparable series presentation.
  
  Edit: and LD, of course. LD is great!
  
  I agree. I think SNW figured out the right formula for a modern Star Trek show. LD too really. It also has that combination and it works.
  
  I think the issue is extent. Crusher fucked a ghost in one ep. DISC storylines drag a full season.

What counts as New Trek?

I enjoyed Discovery up until season 3. Then it lost me. SNW is fantastic though.

Also kind of pissy that they used the bury your gays trope. It's so old.

Back in my day, "new trek" was Enterprise!

Now get off my lawn.

(I'm not actually that old. Edit: also, I hate my lawn and don't care if you walk on it.)
- Look at Mr Moneybags over here!
  
  He has "have a lawn and don't even like it" kind of money!
  
  Probably has a bank account that's in the black by double figures at least once a year!
  
  I was able to buy a house during the Great Recession. I'm well aware of how lucky I am and how screwed just about everybody else of my generation is.
  
  I was just messing with you, but yeah, shits fucked lol
- My dog would love your lawn I'm sure. Together we'll make it into something nice!
I'm the opposite too, Disco really grabbed me in season 3. When Sadil told Burnham "that future is you," I was sold. I honestly teared up, you could feel the weight he carried his entire life being lifted. What a line. Plus the future is a better fit for them and helps avoid continuity issues and all that.

All the gay killin' was disappointing, I agree there.
- I think I only got like three or four episodes into Discovery.
  
  It's just, the whole schwooping them off to a different timeline didn't jive with me. It felt like they didn't like the plot they'd done so far and decided to do a soft reset? Maybe they didn't, but it was so strange and I couldn't get back into it at that point. I loved the mushroom stuff. I wanted to see more of May Ahearn. I loved the bit with her and Tilly, and I didn't feel like all that was done yet.
  
  Have they picked that stuff back up since?
  
  Yeah. Like, as a gay person I love seeing more LGBTQ representation, but it's at the same time kind of annoying when we're always killed off. I guess by some definitions ST:D doesn't really fill the bury your gays criteria but it's close enough to be irksome. Like, why must we always die? 😩
  
  I think I only got like three or four episodes into Discovery
  
  Disco had a rough start because the showrunner Bryan Fuller was fired during preproduction, and they drastically changed the story he had in mind and just ran with it. Fuller has writing credits for the first 3 episodes, which is about where we both gave up on the show (I started again a few years later and got caught up). Those first two seasons are real hit & miss for me, it kinda looked like they were scrambling to develop a compelling story but were under a tight deadline.
  
  The part where they time travel was actually done well, I thought. I had some issues with the tone here and there, but I thought it made sense in universe. It's really too bad Disco had so much turmoil wrt creative control, because I look at how SNW and LD hit the ground running, and it's obvious they had a clear vision from day one and were able to plan everything properly.
  
  Bryan Fuller was fired during preproduction, and they drastically changed the story he had in mind and just ran with it.
  
  On the other hand, Bryan Fuller was responsible for the thing people hated most of all about the first season of Discovery:
  
  The other Bryan Fuller contribution that remains is his redesign of the Klingons. "One of the things he really, really wanted to do was shake up the design of the Klingons," Herberts said. "One of the first things that he ever pitched to us when we were deciding whether or not to come on the show was his aesthetic for the Klingons and how important it was that they be aesthete, that they not be the thugs of the universe, that they be sexy and vital and different from what had come before."
  
  https://www.slashfilm.com/552474/bryan-fuller-redesigned-the-star-trek-discovery-klingons/
  
  I think I'm still on the fence about the revamped Klingon look; I would be 100% ok with it, though, if they reveal it's just the way that Klingon house/subspecies evolved, as some of the fan theories go. The changes are so drastic (even moreso than the changes made between TOS and TNG) that it's jarring. What I never got used to was the Klingon mouth prosthetics; they were so unwieldy that it was hard to understand the dialogue at times. I had to turn on closed captioning.

Feel like Discovery, Lower Decks, and Prodigy are only new trek. Rest is fan service that lacks the push of real trek series. SNW and Picard are fine but not very memorable. Except for the musical episode or cross over with Lower Decks.