Deep Thoughts With The Deep.
I do love how the stupid comment is refuted by a purposely stupid comment that perfectly refutes the first stupid comment in the same realm of stupidity. This is gonna blow some idiots mind.
Right until its sports
Or getting the kids after a divorce
Or giving birth
Or fist fights. Or facial hair.
Well to a certain degree I guess. They're never going to be as equal as numbers can. What is even meant by men and women being "equal"? Equality of opportunity?
Why do you ask?
It's been my experience that people who value equality don't care about the nitty gritty of what it means, because it's a value. An ideal. And if you hold equality as an ideal, that means it's always something to work towards. Inqualities are triaged, but they're all something that we should overcome in the name of fairness and egalitarianism.
Someone always brings up "equality of opportunity vs equality of outcome" when they want to disrupt and derail people who value equality by getting them to wrestle in the mud about how much equality is too much. And, to be frank, it feels like you're trying to throw the "equality of outcome" wrench into the gears here, and I don't believe that is ever done in good faith.
What's the problem with equality of outcome? What does it even mean? Where does the objection come from?
Simply put, it comes from resentment. It comes from the idea that "I worked hard, so I deserve a better quality of life than someone I choose to believe worked less hard!" And that's just a long way of saying "I believe I am more deserving than someone else".
But why? Often this comes from people who already have a certain level of comfort in life believing that they hold more right to that comfort, safety, and happiness than someone else. Too often in this sphere, it comes from people who liked tech and did well in technical subjects in school believing that that entitles them to a higher quality of life than someone who wasn't interested in or had no special aptitude for those subjects. But shouldn't one of the freedoms that comes from equality being the freedom to find joy in what you want? Why should I be rewarded more lucrative Ly than you for enjoying something different?
And if I don't enjoy it, should it really make sense for me to suffer at something I don't enjoy for the sake of wealth? Maybe the equality of outcome is really the equal ability to experience joy, and comfort, and security no matter what we enjoy and how we invest our time? If the world has the resources to allow it, then why should one person be punished for chasing their joy while another is rewarded?
The answer usually boils down to "I made better decisions, so I should be rewarded!" which is just another way of saying "people who make mistakes should be punished!"
And that seems like bullshit. What kind of world is that? Where people aren't safe to make mistakes (and this is ignoring the idea that someone's passion can be considered a mistake)? Where they're punished for trying something different? Or for not jumping on a trend? Where safety and comfort are used as crudgles to force people to do things that make them miserable?
Because that's really what "what do you mean by equality?" is really saying.
Dang, if this isn't a copypasta, it ought to be.
you do have a point in the sense that if we live in a utopia, I think there is good reason to think that it shouldn't matter what choices people make, they all get the same 'reward'/financial outcome/etc.
You said:
If the world has the resources to allow it, then why should one person be punished for chasing their joy while another is rewarded?
Yes okay, but what if there are limited resources? Or a world that needs improvement? Isn't it then better to incentivize people to work hard to make our world of limited resources a world of abundance? If yes, then it means to give those a higher reward at the expense of those who made "other choices".
Are we now living in a world of limited resources / that needs improvement? If yes, then it would probably be justified to take from those who made "other choices"
ok
but what do you mean by equality?
And in the first place, aren't we all different?
Nobody is just man or woman and nothing else. We all have a huge number of traits that all together make us individuals. From the physical like size, hair and so on to the mental, what we enjoy, what interests us and so on.
King Charles, the Rock and me are men. Solely on gender we are the same. But people would be quick to point out all the differences.
Equity: equality of available options.
Plus a whole huge swathe of problematic gender expectations to squash to boot.
No, it's not about squashing the identities themselves, it's about squashing the gendered expectations. Women shouldn't be expected to know how to do laundry, cook, or avoid dirty jobs. Men shouldn't be expected to be tough and "walk off" injury and trauma, etc.
Sure, only some are "different", but remember: It's not about dissing or removing the identities themselves, (outside of the highly problematic ones like the very machismo man) it's about not setting them as expectations for everyone.
No, it's not about squashing the identities themselves, it's about squashing the gendered expectations.
This is basically the same. If you remove the gendered expectations you remove the identity. Gender is the expectations.
That's what makes it so resilient, not willing to renounce deeply held identity, people keep enforcing the expectations.
Women shouldn’t be expected to know how to do laundry, cook, or avoid dirty jobs. Men shouldn’t be expected to be tough and “walk off” injury and trauma, etc.
I know I'm walking a fine line, but still, in general, women have certain interests/traits and thus have their own skills/tendencies: care for children, avoid dirty jobs, etc. And men are tougher thus can more easily "walk off" injury and trauma. So when you see a man and a woman in an accident, both relatively little wounded, would it be morally bad to say to the man "you can probably walk it off", and to the woman "do you need more help with that?" ? Because there is just a higher probability of this being the case. This shouldn't obviously taken for granted, but if you don't know them, and the injuries are right in the middle where you kind of expect them to be okay, but are just on the verge of asking/stating anyway, you would say these things and thus distinguish between them based on gender. Is that so bad?
That's a legit question. People are willing to say stupidest shit to feel socially acceptable.
3 + 2 = 6 + 1
the best part of this dumb comment is that the only way it's right is if you fail at basic arithmetic that single-digit-age children could correct you on
it's a perfect metaphor for sexists and transphobes
This is correct if we use a different number space where the "+" symbol implies multiplication.
