My move to wayland: it's finally ready
My move to wayland: it's finally ready
I was a Wayland detractor, had very bad experiences with it in the past, but I decided to give it a try again, and it’s time to say goodbye to Xorg.
Let's talk about #Linux on the desktop, #Gnome and the state of #Wayland in 2024.
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If you avoid Nvidia, it have been ready for many years. And to be honset, not sure X11 was really stable with Nvidia either. My main issue with Wayland, is that X doesn't have multi dpi support... and for that I really cannot blame Wayland. Also, Skype doesn't have screensharing, well, they actually had for a while, but then removed it... still, hard to blame on Wayland.
But as a general rule, if you have Nvidia, then you are not allowed to complain about anything... that was your choice, and with Nvidia under Linux, all bets are off. I thought that was clear a long time a go, especially after Linus not so subtle outburst.
I got my Nvidia GPU before I even considered moving to Linux. I am honestly getting pretty tired of reading these gatekeeping comments telling me "I'm not allowed to complain about anything" or how I'm a trash person for buying an Nvidia card in the first place. Nvidia is the largest GPU manufacter, people are going to own Nvidia cards, you need to live with it. Be constructive and nice to other people.
X11 is rock solid with Nvidia, never had a single problem.
I had a lot of issues with Wayland on KDE, lots of flickering issues all the time. I moved to Hyprland and things are mostly fine. IntelliJ has ocasional problems but they are working on a Wayland version anyways.
Machine learning pays my bills, and I never had a choice on my graphics card brand. To be sure, I wanted an AMD for the open source drivers, but CUDA remains essential to me. RocM support from AMD is a joke, and isn't anywhere close to an alternative. Reseachers release code that only runs on CUDA for a good reason. To say that I don't get to complain is going too far
Exactly. You'd think with the two things they're really competitive on being raw flops and memory, they'd be a viable option for ML and scientific compute, but they're just such a pain to work with that they're pretty much irrelevant.
That's true, but it also wasn't fair to be a Wayland detractor then.
Nvidia needed to do stuff to make that combination viable, and their delay in doing so wasn't anyone's fault but Nvidia’s
You get to complain to Nvidia, not Linux developers and maintainers.
Ha, your first sentence is just plain wrong. It was quite broken under "normal" usecases with per-DE bugs.
For example, on KDE, about 1.5 years ago the bug finally got fixed where your Wayland session would completely crash if your monitor lost any signal whatsoever (monitor sleep or shutting off the monitor). If you ask me, that is an very standard usecase without which there is no world where said action crashing the entire session would be considered ready for general use.
I think we are there now, just some visual glitches nowadays, also some recent glitches with monitor sleep, but Wayland very rarely crashes anymore.
Thanks to nouveau, I can still use GNOME even after dropping X11 🥳 I have a GeForce 6800M GT, I think, which would need a proprietary nvidia driver that is not supported (but patched by community) since kernel 5 I believe. Only thing that needed to be considered is, that one has to boot via legacy BIOS and not EFI, even on a mac laptop which normally uses EFI to boot into macOS and the grafic card still works. Would be nice if the nouveau team would get the card running on EFI as well.
My personal experience could never agree with that. I could never use Wayland on KDE on either one of my laptops with Intel graphics due to numerous glitches and incompatibilities, so nvidia is not even the scapegoat I wish it was.
I'm looking forward to plasma 6 next month, but at least on KDE, Wayland has not really been usable so far.
My intel graphics laptop (surface pro) runs perfectly on kde wayland
Literally display of why "year of the Linux desktop" is the OG Internet meme. It doesn't work on the most popular and powerful GPU in the planet and that's your fault. 🤦♂️
No, it is Nvidias fault, but you will suffer for it. And it has been well known for 20 years, that Nvidia have bad drivers. So, I'm quite tired of people complaining about Wayland or gaming or anything graphics related, when they have known bad drivers.
Doesn't matter who is at fault. The only thing that matters is driver stability. End users don't care.