Elon Musk Has Used Illegal Drugs, Worrying Leaders at Tesla and SpaceX
Elon Musk Has Used Illegal Drugs, Worrying Leaders at Tesla and SpaceX
This links to the archived version. Original link is: https://www.wsj.com/business/elon-musk-illegal-drugs-e826a9e1
Elon Musk and his supporters offer several explanations for his contrarian views, unfiltered speech and provocative antics. They’re an expression of his creativity. Or the result of his mental-health challenges. Or fallout from his stress, or sleep deprivation.
In recent years, some executives and board members at his companies and others close to the billionaire have developed a persistent concern that there is another component driving his behavior: his use of drugs.
And they fear the Tesla TSLA -0.18%decrease; red down pointing triangle and SpaceX chief executive’s drug use could have major consequences not just for his health, but also the six companies and billions in assets he oversees, according to people familiar with Musk and the companies.
The world’s wealthiest person has used LSD, cocaine, ecstasy and psychedelic mushrooms, often at private parties around the world, where attendees sign nondisclosure agreements or give up their phones to enter, according to people who have witnessed his drug use and others with knowledge of it. Musk has previously smoked marijuana in public and has said he has a prescription for the psychedelic-like ketamine.
In 2018, for example, he took multiple tabs of acid at a party he hosted in Los Angeles. The next year he partied on magic mushrooms at an event in Mexico. In 2021, he took ketamine recreationally with his brother, Kimbal Musk, in Miami at a house party during Art Basel. He has taken illegal drugs with current SpaceX and former Tesla board member Steve Jurvetson.
Etc. etc. That should get the bulk of the summary in. Given Elon Musk's widely known partying in Silicon Valley, as well as him acknowledging the use of both Ketamine and Ambien as party drugs, the news of harder drugs is no surprise to me at least.
Elon has denied this article, but here's some interesting details. This one is spicy:
Hundreds of SpaceX employees gathered around mission control at the rocket company’s headquarters in Hawthorne, Calif., in anticipation of Musk, who was nearly an hour late to arrive at the all-hands meeting about the company’s latest rocket.
When he finally took the stage, Musk was strangely incomprehensible at times. He slurred his words and rambled for around 15 minutes, according to executives in attendance, and referred repeatedly to SpaceX’s Big Falcon Rocket prototype, which was known as BFR, as “Big F—ing Rocket.”
I don't expect much to happen with regards to TSLA board or SpaceX board. But maybe the Feds will be forced to step in? Elon does have a top secret clearance apparently, and hard drugs are a big no-no.
You're viewing a single thread.
I have little respect for Musk - I think he's a horrible person - but I have some conflicting feelings on this one. I've never really been a recreational drug user, and don't even drink much, but most of the ones mentioned haven't been shown to have lasting negative effects, and I don't really care what he does at a party. On the other hand, it shows pretty poor judgement to show up to work impaired. Also, whether or not you agree with it, using illegal drugs isn't compatible with having a security clearance.
LSD, Cocaine, and Alcohol all have significant negative long-term effects. Even if he wasn't taking any of the other drugs, these three are big red flags, especially in combination with the other drugs (ie: Ambien), which mix very poorly.
Its not just the effects of drugs in isolation, when you start mixing into your system like this the negative effects are multiplied.
EDIT: Maybe the other drugs have bad long term effects too. But I'm only familiar with some of these drugs. I too am not a user at all, but consider this a strange benefits to going to a party school for college. You end up meeting a bunch of people experimenting on their own bodies with this stuff.
What are the long-term negative effects of LSD?
At a minimum, my LSD-buddies (well... buddies back in school anyway, its been a decade since I've seen them...) warn me of long-term trips. Sometimes hitting them 6+ months long after they've stopped taking LSD. Obviously everyone's biology is different, but there's some well known long-term effects of LSD in my circles.
Trips that you cannot control are highly stressful. There's something about embedded deeply into your body sometimes, and you'll not necessarily be able to perform at work if one of these deeply embedded LSD-trips hits you at the wrong time.
I don't know if panic attacks, and other stressors are necessarily related to LSD. But they are associated with getting bad trips, and getting pulled into bad trips you cannot control for months later. Heightened anxiety, etc. etc. You can really fuckup your life in the long term with LSD and the rebound effect hitting you at the wrong time.
I’m trying to be democratic here so instead of pointing out individual foibles I’ll rather point out that you’ve cited hearsay and hokum as sources for your assertions. It’s prudent to note that the effects of LSD have been studied in detail by qualified scientists so we (and you) need not rely on your high school buddies for good information on this topic, there are plenty of trustable sources for good information on this topic.
The side-effect LSD staying deep within the body and causing "long-term trips" months later is well studied my man.
You don't need my college buddies to talk about this (although they were the ones who brought it up, since they personally have felt these effects). I also know that its inconsistent: not everyone gets this effect. But not everyone who smokes dies of throat-cancer either. Therefore, these "long-term trips" are absolutely, 100% associated with LSD.
The precise mechanisms need more study, but the side-effects of long-term anxiety and stress from these unwanted trips is well known. Or as those in the culture would say it: "it was bad trip man".
Absolute nonsense. LSD is well studied, yes, and those studies show LSD has a half life of about 3 hours. At that rate, the drug is completely cleared from the system to undetectable levels within a single day.
This is drug war nonsense and you are spreading misinformation.
Yes, users can report ‘flashbacks’ sometimes months later, but whatever the reason, it has nothing to do with the drug still being in the body. To claim so is absolute horsefeathers.
Heh. Its up to you to explain these 3-month or 6-month trips. Not me.
All I want to point out is that LSD has long-term side effects, and you've already acknowledged this fact. I dunno why you're so intent on twisting language around like a damn lawyer. Who cares if LSD is embedded inside of you or if LSD "merely" causes permanent brain damage that lasts for months? It doesn't matter, LSD has long-term side effects. I don't give a shit about the precise mechanism under which it happens. I only care that its documented and well acknowledged. Leave it to the scientists and doctors to argue the whys or hows.
In any case, the long-term risks are known and even you acknowledge them. Everything else discussed is just language, lawyering, or posturing.
In any case, now that Elon Musk has been proven to be taking at minimum, LSD, Cocaine, and Alcohol (all of which have proven long-term effects on the brain, though the exact mechanisms are still medically a mystery), his erratic behavior can in fact be "blamed on drugs" to some extent.
Then again, as some people like to point out: there's no drug that exists that turns you into a far-right white nationalist. So that's just Elon being Elon. But there's a lot of presentations and public appearances where Elon is slurring words, seemingly confused and not fully cognizant of what's seemingly going on. I know the Reddit-RealTesla was talking about some really weird earnings calls last year that could be related to this drugs issue.
If your point is that Elon Musk is fundamentally a piece of shit and that various drugs have nothing to do with that... I can agree with you there. No amount of LSD or Cocaine will turn you into a racist. That's all on Musk's personal life. But there's plenty of behaviors Elon Musk has demonstrated this past year that are indicative of recreational drug use. (IE: Late-night 3am Tweets talking about Alcohol + Ambien). Erratic behavior during public meetings. Bipolar aggressiveness and rage. Euphoric plans to buy Twitter and build an "everything company" and actually believe in that bullshit.
At some point, you have to ask yourself if Elon Musk is bipolar, or if he's tripping on acid. But now we know. He's mixing uppers (cocaine) and downers (alcohol, Ambien), and halluciongens (LSD, Shrooms, Ketamine). That's a lot of fucking experimentation and even some of the hardest-party drug users I know of would shy away from such experimentation and diversity in drug usage. Drug mixtures are one of the least studied issues in party-drug culture, and most smart people would avoid mixing drugs. Its no small wonder that he's acting bipolar if he's really taking all these different drugs randomly at parties.
You are literally repeating an urban legend here and now you’re doubling down.
If you actually care about information then here is a layman’s article form the first page of my Google results:
https://action-rehab.com/does-lsd-stay-in-your-spine/
How LSD is Metabolised by the Body
LSD is usually taken orally in the form of a blot on paper or, less commonly, a pill, a watery solution or a gelatine square known as a pane. It passes into the bloodstream and then into the brain and other organs, where it has its characteristic effects. LSD metabolism – the processing of the drug – is largely done by the liver, which breaks it down into different chemicals.
Because LSD is so strong it is only taken in tiny doses – typically between 65 and 200 micrograms (µg), although doses can be lighter or heavier than that. A microgram is one-millionth of a gram.
This can make it difficult to detect and can only be detected in urine using specialist tests. Most routine urine tests will not pick up LSD but there are some special techniques such as liquid-liquid extraction and ultra-high-performance liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectroscopy (UHPLC-MS/MS) that can.
LSD can be detected in blood but only for a limited time. In one study, researchers were able to detect LSD for up to 16 hours in people who had taken 200 micrograms of the drug. In people who had a lower dose of 100 micrograms, they could only detect it for up to 8 hours. LSD may also be detectable in hair for longer, but this does not mean that it is active in your system as markers stay present as your hair grows. This can be useful for drug tests for some substances but again, as LSD is taken in very small amounts, hair tests can be unreliable for its detection.
Does Acid Stay in Your Spine?
So does LSD stay in the spine and body? There is no scientific evidence that it does. While the tiny amounts involved in a regular dose of LSD make it difficult to detect, the best indications are that acid only stays in the system for a number of hours rather than days, weeks or even years.
The belief probably comes from the long-held idea of ‘flashbacks’, which are themselves difficult to prove or quantify. It is not generally accepted by scientists that flashbacks – if they do exist – are a result of drugs being stored in the spinal column or elsewhere in the body.
Potential Long-Term Effects of LSD in Your System
While the storage of LSD in the spine or elsewhere in the system appears to be a myth, there may be other long-term effects of LSD use. These tend to be more psychological than physical. One study found that a single dose of LSD in healthy volunteers was “subjectively considered a personally meaningful experience that had long-lasting subjective positive effects”.
For others, however, the effects can be negative and very serious. Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder (HPPD), is a condition involving perceptual changes lasting weeks or months following the use of a drug like LSD. Using acid and other hallucinogens can be detrimental to mental health, potentially triggering a mental health episode or exacerbating an existing condition
Pretty sure your buddies are idiots who failed to treat LSD with the respect it deserves and ended up psychologically injured by it. That is not science, that is dumdums.
You are literally repeating an urban legend here and now you’re doubling down.
Your own link doesn't argue against my point.
For others, however, the effects can be negative and very serious. Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder (HPPD), is a condition involving perceptual changes lasting weeks or months following the use of a drug like LSD. Using acid and other hallucinogens can be detrimental to mental health, potentially triggering a mental health episode or exacerbating an existing condition
Okay, thanks for proving my point I guess? There's absolutely risks of long-term serious psychological damage due to long-lasting bad trips.
Aside from the "spine" thing (that my LSD-buddies told me about), I don't think I've misrepresented anything here. I dunno why you're so defensive about this subject. The "spine" theory was popular like 20 years ago, maybe more info is known now and its not about LSD hidden in the spine or whatever, but that doesn't change the fact that HPPD exists (apparently that's the name of this effect? Cool, its got a name now, I'll remember that)
Note: your other post crossed the line of what is useful in discussion. I'm not against getting into a personal fight in most cases, but I'm also the moderator of this lemmy-community so I'll try to keep things clean and try to make myself in better behavior. Your other post was clearly troll-bait at worst, and completely irrelevant to the discussion otherwise.
If you wish to continue talking in this community, keep it clean. This post here of yours doesn't break any rules, but consider this post your fair warning. I'm not afraid to ban you if I have to if you cross the line again.
Please ban me. I have no desire to partake in a community lorded over by idiots.
Involving mod status in a personal argument is beyond pathetic.
I remember hearing something about how an autistic person's brain is effected differently though, mainly unable to go through ego-death, one of the more common experiences related to post-trip psychosis.