I found a major communication problem with public perception of Lemmy. they seem to think a community is tied to a particular instance
I found a major communication problem with public perception of Lemmy. they seem to think a community is tied to a particular instance
This is a big problem. It creates the illusion that /c/cats on one particular instance is the real /c/cats.
This is the root of re-centralization and it must be pulled out.
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OP, could you please link the archive too? The community is set up to NSFW so you can't access it without account, and let us not create accounts in that shithole again.
Here's an archive link for the full thread, as OP here is focusing on one comment.
Anyway: yes, there is a communication problem. I think that the "the whole" and the flagship instances should be called by different names; I've been using "the Lemmyverse" (subset of the Fediverse) and "lemmy.ml flagship instance" (subset of the Lemmyverse) respectively, but that is far from ideal. And what happens is that you invite people to the Lemmyverse and they end in lemmy.ml. Mastodon has a similar problem, by the way.
Specifically on r/stallmanwasright: I used to participate a fair bit in that [rather small] sub, so I'm happy to see them coming to the Lemmyverse. And I feel like it actually fits well within the flagship instance, as it's focused on FOSS enthusiasts. I hope to see u/sigbhu (the head mod there) around - I might not like his approach as moderator*, but in general he's fairly sensible as a person, and his opinions are often worth listening to.
*he tends to confuse too much his personal views with community views.
Then Lemmy is going to just beat repeat of voat. Why is /c/ federation disabled by default. It makes no sense.
You can download Reddit here. All of it, 2tb https://the-eye.eu/redarcs/
Then read it locally with libreddit
Sorry, I edited my comment in the meantime. (Fixing broken grammar, linking the archives, stuff like this.) That said:
Then Lemmy is going to just beat repeat of voat
Not really. Even in worst case scenario (everyone migrates to a single instance), lemmy.ml is considerably wider in scope and userbase than the socially rejected in Voat.
And, while I do agree with you that there is a communication problem, and that it needs to be addressed, it is far from the worst case scenario. For example I consistently see here people from beehaw, lemmy.world, fedddit.de, and other instances.
Why is /c/ federation disabled by default.
Federation happens between instances, not between communities. You can access any community from a federated instance.
If federation is disabled by default (is it?), I think that this might have to do with spam and bot prevention. I'm not sure however.
Now, off-topic:
While I get that spending time in Reddit made us people behave less like decent human beings and more like dumbarses/redditors/morons, even then I think that we should watch out to not behave as such outside Reddit. Let its stupidity culture die with it.
From your comment, three things caught my attention:
- assuming that things that you don't understand "make no sense".
- lack of insight - why are you giving views to that shithole?
- decontextualisation - ipsis ungulis "Then read it locally with libreddit", letting the reader to guess what you're referring to. (I got it, but someone else 2m later won't).
Please, don't.
Not really. Even in worst case scenario (everyone migrates to a single instance), lemmy.ml is considerably wider in scope and userbase than the socially rejected in Voat.
You also have a difference in circumstances. People aren't moving to lemmy.ml because they think that Reddit's moderation and rules are too restrictive, unlike with Voat, which would change who is actually moving over, and the community through that, which is probably why Lemmy's community is a bit on the tech-inclined side, and is a bit less of a politics quagmire.
If federation is disabled by default (is it?), I think that this might have to do with spam and bot prevention. I’m not sure however.
Not to my knowledge. It's probably just a case of it not existing on their instance, but coming up as disabled on their app. Trying to load it up, even on lemmy.ml, seems to just return a "community not found" error, which means that there just isn't one made with that name, rather than a community existing, and being disabled.
decontextualisation - ipsis ungulis “Then read it locally with libreddit”, letting the reader to guess what you’re referring to. (I got it, but someone else 2m later won’t).
Can confirm, was a bit confused. But even with context, 2 TB of data is a ludicrous amount to expect someone to pull. At an optimistic household connection speed of 50 Mbps, that's 4 days straight of uninterrupted downloading, and a lot of off-the-shelf consumer devices don't have that kind of capacity to spare. It's retro, but not in a good way.
That's also a Reddit archive, and would be limited in what kind of posts that it would contain, as anything made after the archive snapshot was taken would not be in it.
I think what they mean by /c/ federation is combining the communities, so that c/technology would combine lemmy.world/c/technology and kbin.social/m/technology and lemmy.ml/c/technology, but I'm not 100% sure.
If that is indeed what the other poster meant, then it's even worse - it's missing the point of federation, that is "let's not centralise our discussions within a single place, as this gives too much power to the people who control that place".
Sure, I agree with you :) I just wanted to clear up what I saw as a misunderstanding, not argue against your point :)
You misunderstand, I am asking for the maximum possible extreme type of decentralization
Yes, I want it all in one place. Preferably in my own, self hosted, single user Lemmy instance. Zero external filtering with my consent, sorting algorithm fully under my control. I will apply my own filters, spamblock, Adblock and moderation subscriptions as I see fit.
That's really interesting about the archive; it's surprisingly small. They must have combined repeated comments, which means there are about a dozen in total, along with some recycled Facebook memes. Now that I think about it, 2TB might be too big! ...I'm joking ;)
Just want to note that Voat was a right-wing hellhole by this point, and the vibe here is extremely different. I'd pulled out of Voat within a week, because the writing was on the wall; big wall, big writing. I'm curious what is making you feel that the Fediverse will be like Voat, because I'm not seeing it. I'm still new here, but it was really obvious on Voat, just a week in.
Now you have me worried that Reddit, in recent years, moved my Overton Window so far right that it no longer sticks out. Oh no.
The current design apparently depends on the ceaseless efforts of atlas-type unpaid volunteers with ultimate and unaccountable moderation powers and a "decentralized" system that heavily favour the biggest community on the biggest instance.
That plus a lot of hope. Just so much hope for the system to somehow not go in the direction of the gravity toward which it is built.
Lemmy is built with federation as an afterthought, decentralization as something to be overcome.